FSDreamTeam forum
Products Support => GSX Support FSX/P3D => Topic started by: Haw-Boo on February 06, 2017, 01:26:53 am
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Hi Folks.
I am a new GSX owner, so apologise if this turns out to be a stupid question.
Basically, is it normal for FSX-SE to start slower with GSX installed? From starting via steam to the initial FSX-SE menu, without GSX it takes 20secs, with GSX it takes 1min 30secs. Does this sound right?
I am working with the very latest of the full download of gsx_fsx_setup.exe, which I downloaded again today.
I have reviewed the documentation and also searched the internet, but could not find anything that reduces this timing. I have followed everything with regards to configuring AV (I am using Win10 Defender). I know this issue is connected with the "Addon Manager", as when I disable it via dll.xml fsx-se then boots in 20secs.
Once started FSX-SE and GSX all appears to work fine, this is just a question around startup times.
If this does not sound right, what might be a good place to start working out what wrong? Are there any log files that might help?
Regards
David.
(i7-6700k (4.6), GTX980Ti (SC+), Asus Z170 Pro Gaming, 16GB Ram, SB ZXR, Win10 64-bit)
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Basically, is it normal for FSX-SE to start slower with GSX installed? From starting via steam to the initial FSX-SE menu, without GSX it takes 20secs, with GSX it takes 1min 30secs. Does this sound right?
Do you have a particularly large Scenery Library ? Especially one with thousands of small files or hundreds of folders ?
If yes, and if you know for sure a folder won't contain any airports, perhaps because it's a scenery mesh/landclass or other non-airport scenery, you can exclude it from being scanned at start, as explained here:
http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,12051.msg92104.html#msg92104
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Hi.
Thanks for your reply, that does look like it should apply to me.
When reading the topic it references an update for "Couatl 3 Public Beta" however the link does not work for me (An Error Has Occurred! The topic or board you are looking for appears to be either missing or off limits to you.) and I do not appear to have the couatl.ini file (presumably only part of that release)?
Are you able to assist please, as I cannot download and install the mention software.
Regards.
David.
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When reading the topic it references an update for "Couatl 3 Public Beta" however the link does not work for me (An Error Has Occurred! The topic or board you are looking for appears to be either missing or off limits to you.)
That's because that setting was added starting with that version, which dated June 2015 so, it has been included with every normal release since then, but of course the Beta is no longer available or needed.
and I do not appear to have the couatl.ini file (presumably only part of that release)?
By default that file doesn't exists. It will be created if you enable Logging in the Troubleshooting section, or you can just create it yourself.
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Hi.
Ah ok, thanks. Sorry for being a newbie to GSX :-)
I will try this out tomorrow as I have to go offline now, will keep you posted.
Regards.
David.
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I'm not a newbie and I found the question very helpfull. Since the last GSX update my FSX:SE takes 2 minutes to load. Very annoying!
Would it help to start up the sim on a default airfield without large scenery files?
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Since the last GSX update my FSX:SE takes 2 minutes to load. Very annoying!
I'm sorry, but nothing related to this has changed in this version. The Scenery Library must be checked for changes at each start, and it has been like this since GSX was released.
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Still, since the update FSX takes double the time to load I'm affraid. So there must be something different going on since there.
I understand it isn't supposed to happen but yet it does. GSX is the only thing that changed.
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Hi.
I am afraid this is not making any difference in start times for me.
I would like to check I am creating the ini file in the right location please. On my Win10 system %appdata% is "C:\Users\David\AppData\Roaming\Virtuali", so I created "Couatl.ini" in there. As a start I then added as a test:
airportCacheExcludeArea=FTX_OLC
airportCacheExcludeArea=Scenery\Global
airportCacheExcludeArea=Scenery\Props
airportCacheExcludeArea=FTX_VECTOR
One thing I noticed is that FTX_OLC and FTX_VECTOR are under a ORBX folder, so I also tried:
airportCacheExcludeArea=ORBX\FTX_OLC
airportCacheExcludeArea=Scenery\Global
airportCacheExcludeArea=Scenery\Props
airportCacheExcludeArea=ORBX\FTX_VECTOR
Whilst testing this ini file addition, I have noticed my start time has become worse. Its now starting randomly between 1min 40sec and 2mins? Is there a way to know if the file is being used/accessed?
I also saw a message about bglmanx.dll failing, but I click yes I wanted it to load, and not seen that message again. But will keep an eye on that.
Also, something else I have noticed, again only with GSX installed. There is a extra delay when clicking the "change" button under "Current Aircraft" when setting up a Free Flight, the delay occurs between button press and the list of aircraft being shown. Also, there is a delay when selecting aircraft and the aircraft 3d model appears in the window and rotates (if you follow me). This only happens with GSX loaded, and the aircraft list and graphics settings in FSX and NVidia have not been changed.
Just to state again, the original problem occurs when starying FSX-SE from steam to the FSX-SE main menu screen - not to a pre-defined flight.
Regards.
David.
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I have just run some more tests, on average I am getting a slower speed 1min 40secs compared to yesterday. I have seen a couple of times it took 1min 45secs and 2mins, but its random. I am really not sure in the ini file is being used, or if I am using it correctly?
I quickly reviewed my system to see what else has changed (incl Win10, AV, NVidia etc) but nothing, and I have made no other changes to FSX other than installing GSX. This situation is repeatable by installing and uninstalling everything GSX, and (with GSX installed) if I disable Addon Manager via dll.xml I instantly get start a solid start time of 20 seconds.
Could you please let me know what else to try, or maybe there are some log files we could enable and review?
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One thing I noticed is that FTX_OLC and FTX_VECTOR are under a ORBX folder, so I also tried:
airportCacheExcludeArea=ORBX\FTX_OLC
airportCacheExcludeArea=Scenery\Global
airportCacheExcludeArea=Scenery\Props
airportCacheExcludeArea=ORBX\FTX_VECTOR
As indicated in the linked post, the FTX_VECTOR area is already excluded automatically by the program even with no Couatl.ini file and, the path is not a problem, since the area will always be found as long it contains that name in its path.
Whilst testing this ini file addition, I have noticed my start time has become worse. Its now starting randomly between 1min 40sec and 2mins? Is there a way to know if the file is being used/accessed?
I'm sorry, but it the worse possible case, you would see little or no improvement, it's not possible the startup would be slower if you add some exclusion areas!
Yes, it's possible to see where the loading is slowing down, with the Windows Performance analyzer in the Task Manager. Have you configured Windows Defender to exclude the FSX folder from scanning ?
We had reports that, if you don't do that, the startup time will be increased a lot, see here:
http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,12051.msg92019.html#msg92019
And yes, it doesn't happen with GSX installed because, what is happening, is that Windows Defender has seen that some executable is reading files, so it CHECKS for each one of them to verify if THOSE files might be threats themselves, which can take a lot, if you have thousands of .BGL.
So, try to disable the whole FSX folder from scanning and, if you have sceneries installed in other folders outside FSX, add those folder to the antivirus exclusion.
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Good tip! I'll try later today!
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Hi.
Thanks for your reply.
Just to confirm, I already have Windows Defender ignoring all FSX key folders, plus for some other applications I use outside this hobby. So, the entire FSX folder is ignored.
With regards to my test results, I am literally reporting back what I see when testing GSX. I am a technical support engineer by trade, and know not to fiddle with other things in order to truly reflect result. I have checked everything on my system, and nothing else is changing other than GSX, but today I am seeing different slower results - on average 1min 40secs.
There is no change at all when I setup the ini file, and presume as you did not comment on its location and use I have it correctly setup. Would really like to know why this file makes no change on start times for me, maybe I am using it wrong? FYI: I used the settings found in the linked document provided, with and without specifying folders - makes no difference at all.
I am just doing another test now, uninstalling and reinstalling GSX. I will report back the results shortly.
Regards.
David.
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I am just doing another test now, uninstalling and reinstalling GSX. I will report back the results shortly.
Please contact me in private to arrange a Teamviewer session, because it's the only way I could see what's the problem in your case.
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Hi.
I have again uninstalled and reinstalled GSX and its components, ensuring to delete directories left behind etc.
As you suggested I monitored things using Perfmon, and interestingly could see FSX.EXE go "not responding" shortly after I started it from steam and almost for the full duration of its start time. CPU usage for FSX.EXE averaged 12. I could see activity on the CPU and memory, if I then switch to view logical processors we can see CPU 2 is cpu bound (or as I say badly flat-lining :-) ). All other values for memory, HDD's are fine. Again, this only occurs with GSX installed. Without GSX, its 20sec loading time.
With regards to Teamviewer, I don't want to sound difficult, but i don't think legally I can do that due to the nature of my job. But I will double check. (company data etc)
Regards.
David.
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I don't think I mentioned, my entire FSX-SE install, software, drivers, and addons, are running on a SSD (Samsung 840 EVO 250GB 2.5-Inch Basic SATA).
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Hi.
I just double checked, and am afraid I cannot use Teamviewer due to legal reasons. But if you let me know the sort of things you would like to review, I can share that information with you via files, screenshots, and videos etc.
Regards.
David.
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As you suggested I monitored things using Perfmon, and interestingly could see FSX.EXE go "not responding" shortly after I started it from steam and almost for the full duration of its start time.
That's not really much of a check. To really know what FSX is doing, and which files are being accessed (if file access is indeed the problem), you should use the monitor disk activity tab, and sort the column by read/write priority, so you can see which files takes longer to being accessed and which process is accessing them.
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Hi.
With all due respect, I have been asking what you needed from me, and am blind without your guidance. I can only provide what you request, so the more details about what you want would be most welcome.
Please see attached screenshots, I hope this is what you are looking for? These were taken all while fsx.exe was "not responding" (in red).
Regards.
David.
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Please see attached screenshots, I hope this is what you are looking for? These were taken all while fsx.exe was "not responding" (in red).
Static screenshots are not very helpful, because I would have to look at the file monitor for the whole duration of the load. I'm sorry, but if you don't want to do a Teamviewer session for whatever reason, there's nothing else I can help you with other than what we already said.
I'm sorry, but if you have reasons to believe TM could be considered a security risk, that's far from it, because it's a product that is used in the Enterprise world quite a bit, and it's specifically designed for remote assistance.
- Nobody can connect to your system unless you start Teamviewer.
- The password changes *every* session so, it's not as if (even if you forget to quit from Teamviewer) that once you gave the password, someone could enter in your system again.
So, it's totally safe to use, and it's very well known and used in the corporate world so, there are really no reasons not to use it.
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Hi.
Companies define business policies internally which dictate what can and cannot be made available, and what is deemed a risk to a company. So its not about the software itself, its what companies themselves wish to dictate.
I will message you privately, and lets see what we can see via TM. I will be responsible for this.
Regards.
David.
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I have just installed TM 12.
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I have just installed TM 12.
For the benefit of everybody else that might have followed this thread, the Teamviewer session I had with Haw-Boo has been very useful, because it helped finding a new way to optimize the startup speed, by adding the biggest OrbX scenery folders to an internal exclusion list in the Addon Manager (Couatl already use it). I sent him an updated version to try, and his loading speed went from more than 1:30 minutes, down to 00:23 seconds!
We thought excluding such folders from the GSX airport cache regeneration was enough but, apparently, they are so many of them, that just checking the folder last modification date (to see if we *should* regenerate the cache) takes some time.
The updated Addon Manager .DLL files are online now, so everybody installing anything from FSDT (GSX, a scenery, the Stand-Alone Addon Manager) will get the update.
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Just had a teamviewer session with Umberto from FSDT, this is the summary of that session:
Umberto setup windows 10 resource monitor so we could see the overview. Then by starting FSX-SE we could monitor CPU, and more importantly Disk usage.
It was within disk usage that we could see (as FSX-SE & GSX starts) heavy accessing of the ORBX scenery files, hence the delay being seen. Umberto tested this further by making the ORBX scenery inactive, and FSX-SE & GSX then started in roughly 20secs.
Umberto then went away with my scenery file and has produced a new version of bglmanx.dll, now with everything activated, FSX & GSX starts in roughly 20secs without the need of INI files etc.
Umberto has said this dll update would be released separately.
Great service & support :-)
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Could this also be applied to other sceneries? (In my case the Aerosoft Mega Airport Amsterdam X package, since that is the only scenery that I have installed)? Or would that be impossible?
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Hi,
Been following this thread with interest. I have no OrbX scenery at all and also startup time of 2-3 minutes. I just saw a message by Haw-Boo about starting FSX-SE not from Steam but from the fsx.exe file directly. I don't see that post anymore. But that worked for me! Startup time back to normal.
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Hi,
Been following this thread with interest. I have no OrbX scenery at all and also startup time of 2-3 minutes. I just saw a message by Haw-Boo about starting FSX-SE not from Steam but from the fsx.exe file directly. I don't see that post anymore. But that worked for me! Startup time back to normal.
Hi.
I am glad that worked for you.
I removed the post as it was not 100% connected with the issue I raised, but it certainly makes a difference. Actually I fly mainly using VR, so startup using FlyInside. I believe FlyInside calls fsx.exe directly, so you get the same performance using that also.
So just to word the original post:
Starting FSXSE via steam, it takes 1 minute.
Starting FSXSE via fsx.exe (outside steam), (for me) it takes 20 seconds.
This is also when using GSX with the new DLL mentioned in this thread.
Regards.
David.
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Starting FSXSE via steam, it takes 1 minute.
Starting FSXSE via fsx.exe (outside steam), (for me) it takes 20 seconds.
This is also when using GSX with the new DLL mentioned in this thread.
The "new" .DLL is already outdated...following this post, I made another fix to optimize loading under Steam, so installing anything from FSDT now, will get the updated .DLL.
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Starting FSXSE via steam, it takes 1 minute.
Starting FSXSE via fsx.exe (outside steam), (for me) it takes 20 seconds.
This is also when using GSX with the new DLL mentioned in this thread.
The "new" .DLL is already outdated...following this post, I made another fix to optimize loading under Steam, so installing anything from FSDT now, will get the updated .DLL.
That's perfect, thanks very much Umberto :-)
Think I will do a uninstall and reinstall of the full package later, does not take long to do. That should grab the new dll also.
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All OK again. Thanks Umberto, great job again! Start up time rund 30s both for FSX and FSX-Steam.
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All good here too. Grabbed in reinstalled the latest version just now, startup time now around 20 seconds for my install but inside and outside steam. Thanks Umberto. As Havenman says - GREAT JOB! :-)
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So, try to disable the whole FSX folder from scanning and, if you have sceneries installed in other folders outside FSX, add those folder to the antivirus exclusion.
Okay, so I timed the start-up of FSX:SE: 2 minutes, 34 secs.
I have now excluded fsx.exe and the FSX folder in Windows Defender.
Startup time has been improved to: 14 seconds!!!
Problem solved here! Thnx!
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I have the same problem since feb 2 update gsx works fine now but fsx takes 2:15 to load from start. i did the latest live update (feb 6) and unchecked all addon scenery. disabled antivirus and no change. after uninstalling gsx, fsxse takes :15 seconds to start.
FSX-SE standalone install
Win7x64
orbx and all scenery and airports disabled in scenery library
GSX always was good until last update. What can i check?
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GSX always was good until last update. What can i check?
Maybe you are confusing the latest Live Update, which only updates the GSX code, with the latest Addon Manager update ? This fix requires the latter and, as I've said in one of the posts in this thread, requires installing anything from FSDT:
The updated Addon Manager .DLL files are online now, so everybody installing anything from FSDT (GSX, a scenery, the Stand-Alone Addon Manager) will get the update.
The "Check for updates" feature cannot be used here, since it's not possible to update the program executables while sim is running.