Author Topic: Why so many so often updates ?  (Read 5229 times)

petakas

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Why so many so often updates ?
« on: December 16, 2014, 10:04:15 pm »
Why are there so many so often updates in GSX ?
If fly average twice a week FSX and almost in every session I start I have GSX updates for download.
The irritating part is that half of those updates are not from inside the QUATL but need the STANDALONE INSTALLER download and install.
Why is that ? (with the standalone).
Its not nice at almost every session to go to website, download, wait, finish, run executable and then to find out that in half of these updates GSX does not activate and to start over again.
Please spare me for problems with my setup and that I have to try it in a new FSX / FSX.cfg, this is the easy answer that can be copy pasted to almost all questions.
My FSX is clean clean.

Uninstalled all GSX related and starting from start.
I am now downloading the full installer again since the standalone did not work and your download speed is slow (~17Kb/sec) needing about 1hr for these 88,1 Mb.
 >:(
Kyprianos Biris

virtuali

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Re: Why so many so often updates ?
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2014, 10:35:25 pm »
Why are there so many so often updates in GSX ?

Because it's a supported product that is constantly updated following all user's suggestions and bug reports.

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If fly average twice a week FSX and almost in every session I start I have GSX updates for download.

That's not the case, these are the update release notes, with dates:

http://www.fsdreamteam.com/couatl_liveupdate_notes.html

As you can see, we had 3 Updates in November, and 3 in December, spaced roughly 1 week from each one, with the exception of two updates in December (2nd and 3rd) which appeared one day after the other.

In addition to that, the Live Update program checks for updates only every 24 HOURS so, it's not possible you would get a notice "almost every session".

And, if you select the "Ignore update" option, you won't asked for another one, until the next one will come.

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The irritating part is that half of those updates are not from inside the QUATL but need the STANDALONE INSTALLER download and install.
Why is that ? (with the standalone).

That's not the case either.

Major Updates are VERY rare, we had one with 1.9 when de-icers came out, and it was extremely uncommon that we had another one after 15 DAYS, when we added support for two separate caches in FSX and P3D (another feature asked by users), and that required a new Couatl.exe which, obviously, cannot be updated while its running.

Apart from these two, which happened within 2 weeks from each one, the last time we had a Major update that required a new Stand-Alone Addon Manager, was in early October ( 2 months ago ) and the one before it was many months earlier.

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Please spare me for problems with my setup and that I have to try it in a new FSX / FSX.cfg, this is the easy answer that can be copy pasted to almost all questions.

I don't see how a "Live Update frequency" question would have anything to do with the FSX.CFG, or about any evidence that when asked about THIS issue, you would have a "copy & paste" reply. Where, exactly, have you seen that ?

Not many users are "annoyed" by the frequency of the updates, so this wasn't a very frequently asked question, so it obviously don't result in a copy & pasted reply, which is instead appropriate when someone asks something that has been asked countless of times, so he could have just searched the forum first. But this is not the case, so why you get the idea you would get such an answer ?

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I am now downloading the full installer again since the standalone did not work

The Stand-Alone obviously worked. But you haven't said what you were trying to achieve with it. If you expected the Stand-Alone would "work" to update GSX to 1.9, than it's to be expected it "wouldn't work" because, as clearly explained in the release notes and the forum update announcement, it's NOT enough to install the current Stand-Alone Addon Manager to get a complete 1.9 update, and you must also update your vehicles OR use the Full GSX installer.

If, instead, with "did not work", you meant something else, then please explain what problem you had with the Stand-Alone Addon Manager.

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and your download speed is slow (~17Kb/sec) needing about 1hr for these 88,1 Mb.

Our (which is not even "our", but it's Mediafire's) UPLOAD speed is very fast, see proof in the attached screenshot, taken minutes ago.

It's your download speed which is slow, and this might be caused by your ISP which is throttling downloads from Mediafire, we had reports of some ISPs doing this. And no, it's not a  distance issue, because Mediafire is in Texas, and I'm in Switzerland...
« Last Edit: December 16, 2014, 10:38:25 pm by virtuali »

boilerbill

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Re: Why so many so often updates ?
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2014, 10:40:14 pm »
I can't recall somebody complaining about software being updated too often. That said, you don't need to install every one of them. Read through the reasons for the update (#2 in the list, as I recall) before deciding what to do. If it doesn't affect you (an aircraft you don't own, FSX vs. P3D,etc.), ignore it.
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petakas

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Re: Why so many so often updates ?
« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2014, 07:57:13 am »
That's not the case, these are the update release notes, with dates:

http://www.fsdreamteam.com/couatl_liveupdate_notes.html

As you can see, we had 3 Updates in November, and 3 in December, spaced roughly 1 week from each one, with the exception of two updates in December (2nd and 3rd) which appeared one day after the other.

In addition to that, the Live Update program checks for updates only every 24 HOURS so, it's not possible you would get a notice "almost every session".

And, if you select the "Ignore update" option, you won't asked for another one, until the next one will come.
OK understood but it just happened that I flew not often enough in December to get each time an update request.

The problem is that this update(s) for some reason it(they) deactivated QUATL and I had to reinstall manually each time.
The fix was to uninstall all QUATL/GSX related from programs and reinstall it via full installer.
Then I fell in to the slow download (speed) issue.
For some reason the standalone installer deactivated the whole GSX after I installed it.

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That's not the case either.

Major Updates are VERY rare, we had one with 1.9 when de-icers came out, and it was extremely uncommon that we had another one after 15 DAYS, when we added support for two separate caches in FSX and P3D (another feature asked by users), and that required a new Couatl.exe which, obviously, cannot be updated while its running.

Apart from these two, which happened within 2 weeks from each one, the last time we had a Major update that required a new Stand-Alone Addon Manager, was in early October ( 2 months ago ) and the one before it was many months earlier.

Indeed, I had done the 1.9 install and following this the next update (before 14th Dec.) required a standalone installer update. Thats what I did and then yesterday it asked again for standalone installer.
In my Windows7 Home 64 I am admin, so its not an issue related to this.
In each of the updates above FSX.cfg was updated because I had to approve on FSX boot the new file to run there where FSX asks you about new DLLs etc.

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I don't see how a "Live Update frequency" question would have anything to do with the FSX.CFG, or about any evidence that when asked about THIS issue, you would have a "copy & paste" reply. Where, exactly, have you seen that ?

Not many users are "annoyed" by the frequency of the updates, so this wasn't a very frequently asked question, so it obviously don't result in a copy & pasted reply, which is instead appropriate when someone asks something that has been asked countless of times, so he could have just searched the forum first. But this is not the case, so why you get the idea you would get such an answer ?

Umberto I say this because I observe in many support posts a pattern of replies around this. The most usual reply is back up and delete your FSX.CFG and run FSX with a fresh one. I just asked not to get this reply because it is not an FSX.CFG issue. Something does not register in these installations and QUATL/GSX asks for update and when updated it deactivates GSX and I have to do manual full GSX uninstall and full installer install from beginning. Thats what I did yesterday and it worked but its irritating to do this every time !

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The Stand-Alone obviously worked. But you haven't said what you were trying to achieve with it. If you expected the Stand-Alone would "work" to update GSX to 1.9, than it's to be expected it "wouldn't work" because, as clearly explained in the release notes and the forum update announcement, it's NOT enough to install the current Stand-Alone Addon Manager to get a complete 1.9 update, and you must also update your vehicles OR use the Full GSX installer.

If, instead, with "did not work", you meant something else, then please explain what problem you had with the Stand-Alone Addon Manager.

In 1.9 I followed the instructions and actually did a full uninstall and full install with full installer, not just the standalone.

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Our (which is not even "our", but it's Mediafire's) UPLOAD speed is very fast, see proof in the attached screenshot, taken minutes ago.

It's your download speed which is slow, and this might be caused by your ISP which is throttling downloads from Mediafire, we had reports of some ISPs doing this. And no, it's not a  distance issue, because Mediafire is in Texas, and I'm in Switzerland...

OK understood, I reported it because other activity was going fast (with no other downloads at time) I have a fast line and especially yesterday - only time I've seen this - the full installer download process was exceptionally slow.
This came as a bonus to the issue of needing to uninstall all GSX related and reinstall full installer.
I just had to wait for the download to finish.

In the end I gave up (the FSX session) and let it download while I went to bed.

Apologies if my comments sound a bit critical but while I really admire this software it is the only one that all so often needs every time an update.
The update then makes it deactivate and then each time I have to do full reinstall.
That is what causes my discomfort.

I really appreciate a working team responding so fast to user feedback and issuing updates. You are the only one I have seen work this way and congratulations but in my case the interim updates of standalone installer updates deactivate the product. The small updates that run within FSX by QUATL don't, these are OK.

Could it be related to what I document here ?
http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,11228.0.html
There I don't know whether I should accept or not.
YES or NO ?
It does not mention which not installed product.
The only not installed product I have is the old JFK for FSX I had bought before buying v2 (and update to 2.1).
Could that be the cause of my standalone installer installation deactivating QUATL after installation ?
« Last Edit: December 17, 2014, 10:32:52 am by virtuali »
Kyprianos Biris

virtuali

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Re: Why so many so often updates ?
« Reply #4 on: December 17, 2014, 11:00:57 am »
The problem is that this update(s) for some reason it(they) deactivated QUATL and I had to reinstall manually each time.

No, it didn't. I can't possibly know why it happened on your system, perhaps a problem with the antivirus or a bad download, but it surely doesn't deactivate anything. There might be another reason too, read further.

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Indeed, I had done the 1.9 install and following this the next update (before 14th Dec.) required a standalone installer update. Thats what I did and then yesterday it asked again for standalone installer.

As I've said, the two last updates were spaced 15 days from each other, which is an unusually short time, because they are usually spaced months apart, but there there wasn't any other way to do the separate caches feature.

This is of course a feature that only concerns users with BOTH FSX and Prepar3D installed on the same system so, if you weren't in that situation, by reading the release notes, you could have decided to skip that update.

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In my Windows7 Home 64 I am admin, so its not an issue related to this.

What this has anything to do with it ? I'm saying that everything you reported is NORMAL, except the fact that the "Stand-Alone disables Couatl", which is not the case, and if it happens on *your* system, it's entirely unrelated to the fact you are admin or not.

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In each of the updates above FSX.cfg was updated because I had to approve on FSX boot the new file to run there where FSX asks you about new DLLs etc.

And why you think this might be a "problem", or an indication of it ? A Major update IS, by definition, an update which updates an executable, either a .DLL or an .EXE or a .GAU and when updated executables are launched for the first time, FSX WILL require you to trust them and WILL save your trust preference in the FSX.CFG. That's how FSX works, for every executable of every developer.

In addition to that, when you Uninstall and reply YES to the questions "Do you want to remove the Addon Manage ? " and Couatl, the Uninstaller will remove every line belonging to the Addon Manager and Couatl in your FSX.CFG, so it's entirely normal it would be changed in this case too.

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Umberto I say this because I observe in many support posts a pattern of replies around this. The most usual reply is back up and delete your FSX.CFG and run FSX with a fresh one.

You might have observed the reply, but have you read the *question* too ? This reply is the one that is being given ONLY in these case:

- Objects that disappears when getting close, or objects that have parts of them invisible, or where you can see their sounds (so the objects are there) but not object.

- Other add-ons or the user) having wrongly removed the default SimObjectsPaths line for the default Misc folder, so none objects will be found, because they are installed there, in a folder and a line that must be normally present in every FSX installation.

This is the ONLY case where the reply about resetting the FSX.CFG is ever given.

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Something does not register in these installations and QUATL/GSX asks for update and when updated it deactivates GSX and I have to do manual full GSX uninstall and full installer install from beginning. Thats what I did yesterday and it worked but its irritating to do this every time !

This doesn't have anything to do with the installer. It's instead possible that you have a problem with one version of the several VC++ 2005 runtimes that might be installed on a system. There might be many different versions of the VC++ 2005 runtimes installed, and some users have ONE version missing/corrupted and other users might have ANOTHER one.

Since we can't possibly anticipate which one might be missing/corrupted on any given user's system, we have two *slightly* different version of the Addon Manager, one that requires one build of the VC++ 2005 runtimes, another which requires another one. One is downloaded by the full installers, the other by the Stand-Alone Addon Manager installer, assuming that is *very* unlikely that an user would have BOTH of them missing/corrupted, it's expected that at least one of them would work.

In your case, it looks like you have a problem with the version of the VC++ 2005 library that is used by the Stand-Alone Addon Manager version, but the one used by the full installer is working. Other users might have the opposite problem. Most of them (which is the normal situation) don't have any problems with either, so they won't see any difference using one or the other.

So, you are mislead thinking the Stand-Alone Addon Manager "disables" something, when in fact it's only EXPOSING a problem with your system that you already had.

Yes, both the Stand-Alone Addon Mananger AND the full installer installs the CORRECT version of the VC++ 2005 library THEY need, and they do this by launching the official MS installer for those libraries, but sometimes the MS installer cannot fix all problems, so we are forced to use this solution, hoping that at least ONE of them will work.

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In 1.9 I followed the instructions and actually did a full uninstall and full install with full installer, not just the standalone.

Then it should have worked. No reason why it would't, and if it happens again, please report it, so we can check why it didn't work on your specific case.

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I really appreciate a working team responding so fast to user feedback and issuing updates. You are the only one I have seen work this way and congratulations but in my case the interim updates of standalone installer updates deactivate the product. The small updates that run within FSX by QUATL don't, these are OK.

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Could it be related to what I document here ?
http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,11228.0.html

Surely not. The AFCADs are just the airport definitions, and it doesn't make any difference to the program if you update them or not. If you don't edit AFCADs, always reply YES.

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It does not mention which not installed product.

It will automatically look which FSDT sceneries you have, and download updated AFCAD JUST for those you have installed.

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The only not installed product I have is the old JFK for FSX I had bought before buying v2 (and update to 2.1).
Could that be the cause of my standalone installer installation deactivating QUATL after installation ?

Obviously not. I already indicated a possible reason above.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2014, 11:03:18 am by virtuali »

petakas

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Re: Why so many so often updates ?
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2014, 12:53:40 pm »
Thanks for the detailed reply.
Can you please tell me which versions of VC++ I need to have installed for each to make sure I have both for next time ?
Kyprianos Biris

virtuali

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Re: Why so many so often updates ?
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2014, 02:34:36 pm »
Can you please tell me which versions of VC++ I need to have installed for each to make sure I have both for next time ?

As I've said in my previous message, it's not as simple as just installing the "right" version of the library.

Both installers DO come with the correct version of the library, and BOTH installs it when they run, launching official installer made by MS so, the installer are ALREADY doing what you could be able to do on your own, which is finding for the library on the MS site, and installing it using the MS installer.

If just installing the MS installers would be enough to fix any problem of missing/corrupted libraries, this problem wouldn't exists in the first place, because our installers already install everything that is needed to run the software, nothing "missing" from the installers.

The issue is, the MS installer is NOT able to fix everything. Sometimes a manual uninstall of all previous version might be needed first, sometimes the problem is even more complex and requires going into the registry and knowing what to do, and this can't be possibly sorted out by the installers.

That's the main issue with Windows Side-by-Side libraries that, although they are supposed to fix a lot of problems with different (incompatible) versions of the same .DLLs used by different products, they can create a whole new set of problems, when things go wrong.

And this is not really my opinion. Want to hear ANOTHER opinion ? See this, from Pete Dowson, FSUIPC author:

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/323009-simconnect-gone-mad/?p=1909995#entry1909995

I'll quote here the relevant part, where he's saying exactly the SAME thing:

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I've got two PCs, one running Win7 and the other XP, and both of them have broken SimConnect installations. I have not been able to find any way to repair either without reinstalling Windows. I actually broke them deliberately (!) in order to research this, but I failed miserably to find a solution other than Windows re-installation (which I'll do one day, if only to tidy up my increasingly rubbish-ridden systems).

In my opinion the side-by-Side library system is the most diabolically convoluted system ever conceived and implemented by Microsoft and when it goes wrong it is fatal.

Here he's referring to Simconnect, which is just another Windows Side-by-side library, same as the VC++ runtimes, so it's the same issue, really, just that with Simconnect it's easier, because there are only 3 versions, and only FSX use that one. The VC++ runtimes are way more, there are multiple sub-versions for every major versions, and they are used by *everything*, basically.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2014, 02:36:34 pm by virtuali »

Bruce Hamilton

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Re: Why so many so often updates ?
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2014, 11:30:00 pm »
If it doesn't affect you (an aircraft you don't own, FSX vs. P3D,etc.), ignore it.

Ignoring an update just delays the inevitable, you'll get it next time.
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