P3D v1.4

[Kosta]

Not asking when, but asking how do I know when it becomes available? Will you post an announcement or will there just be an update?

[virtuali]

The updated Addon Manager is already available since yesterday, but I had to wait for all the updated installers for all products to be uploaded, which ended just a few minutes ago.

It couldn't be a Live Update, because if you reinstalled P3D 1.4 from scratch (which is what most people will do), you had to reinstall all products too, so you will have to re-download all installers now, since the old installers didn't recognize P3D 1.4. The only installer which was already compatible with P3D 1.4 it's Flightbeam's KPHX, so it's the only one that doesn't require downloading it again, but just *running* it again, to get the updated Addon Manager .DLL.

[Kosta]

Great!

So as of now, I can download ALL the FSX installers from the airports I own and install them into P3D?

Does this mean I should be using FSXP3D Migrator Tool or should I just do it without? Because later on I am running the legacy mode by the migrator, so that EFB will work - this means no prepar3d.exe is run but fsx.exe.

[virtuali]

So as of now, I can download ALL the FSX installers from the airports I own and install them into P3D?

Yes.

Does this mean I should be using FSXP3D Migrator Tool or should I just do it without? Because later on I am running the legacy mode by the migrator, so that EFB will work - this means no prepar3d.exe is run but fsx.exe.

I don't know how that tool works, if it's fooling installers to install inside P3D thinking it might be FSX, there might be issues with products with proper P3D support, like our own, because they need to know it's *really* P3D you are installing into, because there are few things that needs to be changed in the XML file (Couatl, for example, needs a command line switch to enable P3D mode, so it will look into P3D folders and config files in their correct locations)

I guess you shouldn't use that tool, for products that have real P3D support.

[Kosta]

Alright. I'll give it a whirl.

This tool is very important as I intend on publishing a guide for FSX users on AVSIM on how to port to P3D, and this tool plays a big role, as it is basically one thing with which you can install bunch of Aerosoft, UK2000, Flytampa, PMDG and other stuff... which is of course FSX native.

I just hope that after the installation FSDT has nothing against me running P3D in legacy mode, meaning like fsx.exe.

I'll post here when done, so you know how it worked out exactly (possible help for future users), as I believe there are going to be many more after I'm down with the post.

[Kosta]

OK here is an update: without migrator, everything is peachy. Installation went OK, installed, ran LSZH+GSX...

I didn't even try installing with the migrator.

But unfortunately, running in the Legacy Mode disables Addon Manager for some reason - would there be any chance you could maybe look into making it work with the legacy mode? I don't know any backgrounds with this stuff, apparently when addon manager that is for P3D doesn't find prepar3d.exe, it won't load.

Running with the open migrator, but not in the legacy mode is completely fine.

[virtuali]

I just hope that after the installation FSDT has nothing against me running P3D in legacy mode, meaning like fsx.exe.

As I've said, it's possible there will be some issues: if our installers are tricked into believing they are installing in FSX, they will not enable some specific P3D configurations, so it's likely that nothing will work.

The most important thing to be checked is:

On the %APPDATA%\Lookheed Martin\Prepar3D\EXE.XML file, the section that launched the Couatl program should look like this:


<Launch.Addon>
  <Name>Couatl</Name>
  <Disabled>True</Disabled>
  <ManualLoad>False</ManualLoad>
  <Path>fsdreamteam\couatl\couatl.exe</Path>
  <CommandLine>--mode=prepar3d</CommandLine>
</Launch.Addon>


Note this line:


<CommandLine>--mode=prepar3d</CommandLine>


If the installer believes it's running in FSX, it will not add that line so, you will add it yourself after the installation.

[Kosta]

I have exactly that.

If I forced addon manager to run in FSX mode for p3d in legacy mode, would that work? What do you think?

[virtuali]

But unfortunately, running in the Legacy Mode disables Addon Manager for some reason - would there be any chance you could maybe look into making it work with the legacy mode? I don't know any backgrounds with this stuff, apparently when addon manager that is for P3D doesn't find prepar3d.exe, it won't load.

I guess that's the likely the reason: if the migrator hides or renames the prepar3d.exe and replace it with a dummy fsx.exe, the Addon Manager won't work, because it's doing the correct thing, which is checking the executable (doesn't matter how it's named, it checks whichever executable the Addon Manager was launched by) actual file version, and depending on that version, it decides to enable FSX or P3D support. If the .EXE is not the real one, the Addon Manager will not recognize it and will not work.

I'm sorry, but we already did the RIGHT thing, which is supporting P3D NATIVELY. We don't have any plans to do additional work, just to support a tool that shouldn't be needed in the first place, because they right thing for other developers to do, would be doing the additional work we ALREADY made, to adapt their installers to run in P3D proper.

[virtuali]

If I forced addon manager to run in FSX mode for p3d in legacy mode, would that work? What do you think?

I don't have any idea, without knowing *exactly* what legacy mode does.

[Kosta]

I'm sorry, but we already did the RIGHT thing, which is supporting P3D NATIVELY. We don't have any plans to do additional work, just to support a tool that shouldn't be needed in the first place, because they right thing for other developers to do, would be doing the additional work we ALREADY made, to adapt their installers to run in P3D proper.

Man, don't get angry that fast, we are just talking  

Anyway, I am completely with you. All should just make installers for P3D and that would be that. I respect what you guys at FSDT did, making it all fully compatible.
Being what I am at AVSIM, I take a bit of burden on myself at looking at this stuff for our users there, as I know these questions will pop up sooner or later.

All is good Umberto, thank you for the hard work behind this!

[virtuali]

After reading a bit on the support forum for the P3D migration tool, I think I understood what legacy mode does and yes, it shouldn't be used with our products.

One thing it does, it makes a copy of the prepar3d.exe to fsx.exe, and patches its version information, as it were FSX. So, an old program that checks for the existing FSX.EXE process, will be able to find it, complete with the version its expects to find.

However, this will entirely screw up our products because, we decide from the version information of whatever executable launched the Addon Manager, which version of FSX or P3D is running under and, based on that information, we set several offset in memory that we need to access.

This means, the information must be correct: if I'm getting an FSX version number from the renamed Prepar3d.EXE that launched the Addon Manager, I assuming I'm running under FSX (but I'm not), so I'll look into memory addresses that are valid for FSX, but will not work in P3D in the best case, and will make the program crash in the worse case.

The reason for needing direct in-memory access, is because there are things we can't get in any other way from the official Simconnect API like, for example, the actual coordinates of the eyepoint position, which are needed to enable Surround sound in GSX, but there are several others.

[virtuali]

Man, don't get angry that fast, we are just talking  

I can't see any trace of angriness in my reply...I was merely illustrating the situation.

[Kosta]

OK, so basically the problem lies in the fact that p3d mode of addon manager looks into different memory locations than it does with original fsx.exe, if I understood that correctly and that makes it impossible to run with the legacy mode. A 100% no-go.

I already thought this legacy mode is a bit of a drag, because you are going backwards instead of forward.

Well Umberto, thank you and look for a big comparison post soon in p3d forum, which will also contain some fsdt shots (although no comparisons for those as I didn't make them back in the fsx and fsx is already byebye).

[Nitr0x21]

Hi Kosta

I had the same Problem with EFB. furtunatly this was the only addon that i had who needs legacy mode. Just in case you aren't aware of
there is a workaround until EFB 2 comes out: Just rename an executable (some kind of freeware Notepad as example) to fsx.exe and check
if it appears as fsx.exe in the Task manager. Then you can run EFB and have Prepare3d running in native mode.
Works fine for me, maybee that's an option ? In my mind it's clearly avilasoft fault who should release an P3d Version.