Author Topic: New FSXBA Hornet  (Read 1148522 times)

jimi08

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #555 on: January 06, 2015, 11:47:46 pm »
Thanks for the input.  Took at look at your aircraft and .air files.  I see you included the hi-alpha entries in the aircraft.cfg.  Did you change anything else in the aircraft config?  What about the .air file?  Thanks.

Justin "Jimi" Hendrix
FSX Blue Angels
FSXBA F/A-18C Hornet Latest Download Link: http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,6944.msg117011.html#msg1

hd764jvgd843

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #556 on: January 07, 2015, 01:16:15 am »
Thanks for the hint from A1-F18AC-NFM-000. I had a quick search but didn't quite make it to section 11.1.3

When flying tight turns with full dry thrust, low altitude, the aircaft becomes unstable long before 50 deg. AoA, something around 38 to 40 deg. AOA and you go off, with a stall warning. I haven't found out where to modify in the .air file to broaden the flight envelope before stall warning occurs.

Concerning your questions:
- The aircraft.cfg is quite different from your latest version 14.18, e.g. I have modified cp's to work in conjunction with CS version. Still experimenting with the empty_weight_cg, because at -27.00 with full flaps during a landing approach the bird does not hold its AoA.
- In the .air file I have modified entry no. 404 being able to pull generally higher AoAs and no. 473 to limit the neg. AoA to around -6 degrees. I have also added at no. 401 a general drag curve for sub/supersonic speed. Most of the changes I have done are in the section from 400 - 473. The drag values in the primary aerodynamics section are the ones I use to clock the plane at 35,000 ft in under two minutes from 0.8 to 1.6 Mach. I have also experimented with the thrust vector vs mach AB function.
- I found the hi_alpha entries in the fsx airfile configuration and tried experimenting with them. They seem to have a slight influence on how the aircraft handles during tight turns at high AoAs at slow speed. You can see it quite good from a tower perspective coming out of a tight turn straight head on, with both hi_alpha entries set to zero, she will slide much more sideways and the general feel is much more 'artificial'. When both values set to 1.0 (default) the flight path seems to be more natural/cleaner, less gearing - in my opinion, but I am not sure which one is more realistic, or what the FCS would do in reality.

Currently I am experimenting with entry no. 404, but I am not satisfied with the max. AoA setting yet. I will try to set it so you can pull up to 50 to 55 degrees AoA.

Stall warning and instability is another issue. If you have an idea where to look, in order to broaden the flight envelope so the instability / stall warning kicks in not before 50 to 55 deg. AoA, please let me know.

Shaking effects:
As I am using A2A accu feel, I disabled the stall shaker function in their program, because the largest value you can set here is 25 deg. AoA, which is far too early to for an FA-18. Is there a way to implement a VC shake, like the one when pulling high g, that would shake the VC when you approach high AoAs e.g. 40, 50, or 55 deg. to show that you are actually approaching the stall / instability threshold?

I will post aircraft.cfg and .air files the next days or so when I have something new.

Feedback and suggestions are welcome!
« Last Edit: January 07, 2015, 01:22:09 am by hd764jvgd843 »

jimi08

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #557 on: January 07, 2015, 08:03:58 am »

Shaking effects:
As I am using A2A accu feel, I disabled the stall shaker function in their program, because the largest value you can set here is 25 deg. AoA, which is far too early to for an FA-18.

Where are you getting your facts for this one? 
BLUF: Based on my research buffeting occurs around 25 deg AOA due to the vortices generated by the LEXs hitting the vertical stabs.  In terms of wing buffeting, you are correct, that does happen at a later AOA.  With flaps HALF or FULL, buffeting occurs much sooner

NATOPS:
11.1.2.1 Stalls in HALF or FULL Flaps. With flaps HALF one g stalls exhibit somewhat better lateral
directional flying qualities than with flaps FULL. Wing rock and sideslip excursions occur in the 20°
AOA region. Warning cues occur at 12° (increasing stick force gradient) and 15° (departure warning
tone). With flaps FULL, as AOA increases to 12°, buffet and the departure warning tone provide good
stall warning cues of impending high AOA.
At 12° AOA, an increase in the stick force/AOA gradient
can also be felt. This provides additional stall warning. Onset of wing rock occurs in the 15° AOA
region. As AOA is further increased, aft stick requirements increase. Wing rock increases in amplitude
and is accompanied by sideslip oscillations as the aft stick stop is reached. For either flap setting,
maximum attainable AOA is about 25°. Large rates of descent may occur above the AOA limit in
HALF or FULL flaps. Immediate stall recovery is obtained by neutralizing longitudinal stick which
rapidly reduces AOA and allows the aircraft to attain the current trim value.

refs:
-Alleviation of Vertical Tail Buffeting of F/A-18 Aircraft http://arc.aiaa.org/doi/abs/10.2514/1.9327?journalCode=ja
-Hornet NATOPS

Justin "Jimi" Hendrix
FSX Blue Angels
FSXBA F/A-18C Hornet Latest Download Link: http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,6944.msg117011.html#msg1

jimi08

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #558 on: January 07, 2015, 08:43:38 am »
Happy New Year Everyone,

Well, thanks to the efforts and many and in particular our very own ORION, we have made some great strides over the holiday season.  Please find below the download link for the 15.2 Fleet Version.

Download Link: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3So3WwTLPRZSzNWMUg3eGRZVDg/view?usp=sharing

Changes include:
-Updated Leading Edge and Trailing Edge Flap logic:  Big thanks to ORION on his incredible work and efforts with this gauge.  Both sets of flaps now operate linearly (i.e. degree by degree, instead of using only 1 of 10 flaps settings) and each set of flaps operate by their own logic as described in the NATOPS.  Also, HALF and FULL flaps also operate as advertised in NATOPS.  Half and Full flaps are now able to be selected with or without gear down and automatically transition to AUTO above 250 KIAS.  Also, the Pitch Auto Trim function is now tried to flaps being placed in AUTO.  As per NATOPS, HALF and FULL Trailing Edge Flaps also auto extend and retract as a function of airspeed when selected.  If HALF Flaps are selected, the TEF will reach their full extension of 30 deg. at approximately 180 KTAS and below.  With FULL selected, TEFs will reach their full extension of 45 deg at approx. 150 KTAS.

-Updated Throttle Control:  Always a work in progress.  Still making adjustments/corrections to Burners.

-Tweaks to Autorudder have also been made.

Justin "Jimi" Hendrix
FSX Blue Angels
FSXBA F/A-18C Hornet Latest Download Link: http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,6944.msg117011.html#msg1

hd764jvgd843

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #559 on: January 07, 2015, 11:04:32 am »

Shaking effects:
As I am using A2A accu feel, I disabled the stall shaker function in their program, because the largest value you can set here is 25 deg. AoA, which is far too early to for an FA-18.

Where are you getting your facts for this one?  
BLUF: Based on my research buffeting occurs around 25 deg AOA due to the vortices generated by the LEXs hitting the vertical stabs.  In terms of wing buffeting, you are correct, that does happen at a later AOA.  With flaps HALF or FULL, buffeting occurs much sooner

refs:
-Alleviation of Vertical Tail Buffeting of F/A-18 Aircraft http://arc.aiaa.org/doi/abs/10.2514/1.9327?journalCode=ja
-Hornet NATOPS

As I understand A2A stall shaker induces wing buffeting indicating that you are approaching stall conditions. It works quite well for all other airplanes that cannot pull such high AoA as the Hornet does (I have tried to talk to them last year about the 25 deg AoA limit for the stall shaker but never got an answer).

The issue I noticed is that you get the shaking at say 25 deg AoA (A2A max setting, or any other lower one you may adjust it to) and when you pull more, e.g. you reach 40 deg AoA the shake seems to be gone and you stall and spin out of control. So the stall shaker effect does not seem to progress linear or in any other way I could notice. It seems to be limited around the adjusted value.

In order to experiment with settings in the .air file and get the correct feedback I decided to disable the A2A stall shake for now, because it felt unrealistic once you go beyond the 30 deg. AoA.

In general such a shaker feedback/function adds very much realism and feel to flying (like with the g load shaking), it would be nice if buffeting could be realized in any correct way, depending on AoA and current flaps positions, as you pointed out it might occur much earlier under some conditions.

P.S. Thanks for posting the new 15.2 bird, much appreciated! I will give it a try as soon as I get home.

Here is some quick feedback for the new version:
AutoFlaps seem to work well and as intended - really great work here! Two things I have noticed:
a) When you crash the new 15.2 plane and P3D resets the flight, the simulator crashes each time (may have something to do how the Autoflaps.dll is loaded/unloaded or reset). This does only happen with the new bird, all other aircraft seem unaffected.
b) When you take off (full flaps engaged) and retract the gear once you are in the air, flaps remain set at full and they do not transition to Auto as they did before. Intended?

I will have a detailed look at the changes in .cfg .air file later.

Best regards...
« Last Edit: January 07, 2015, 01:07:55 pm by hd764jvgd843 »

Orion

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #560 on: January 07, 2015, 09:57:48 pm »
Peter, if you replace the existing DLL with this one, does it work without crashing?  Also, the flaps are independent of the gear, as described in NATOPS (see section 2.8.4.1 Flap Operation).

pyroperson87

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #561 on: January 08, 2015, 04:58:28 am »
Jimi/Orion...fantastic work on the improved jet! She flies exceptionally well and I haven't noted any issues at all so far.
Pops

hd764jvgd843

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #562 on: January 08, 2015, 01:38:12 pm »
Peter, if you replace the existing DLL with this one, does it work without crashing?  Also, the flaps are independent of the gear, as described in NATOPS (see section 2.8.4.1 Flap Operation).

Hello Orion,

sorry for the delayed feedback, I just got home. The new dll you posted works without crashes during reset, now!
Thanks for the quick update - really great work, much appreciated!

Please apologize my lack of knowledge, as I must admit I have not completely read NATOPS, yet.
When you get accustomed to things that are wrong, you stumble over them when they get corrected! Thanks for pointing out the relevant section.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2015, 01:43:05 pm by hd764jvgd843 »

Azframer

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #563 on: January 08, 2015, 04:56:06 pm »
J had Downloaded the 2012 FSX Blue Angel and absolutely loved it, I loved it so much I emailed maker and asked if I could add it to another forum and was granted permission. Shortly after posting some screen shots the snobs came out in a couple of the main posters over there and I just deleted my screenshots and never participated over there again.
I only say that to make this point, Jimi you are poring your heart and soul into this project and it shows 100%. I spent 2 days reading this thread from beginning to end before even joining the group, Ive read nothing else but this one thread. I wanted to make sure I had the latest version of both the sets.
The collaboration is what I wanted to be a part of in the last group, you have some great help here the guys working on paint are doing a great job. Between reading this thread and flying the planes, as little as I been able to fly them I have not yet been able to try to correct the blue in the D model cockpit that was mentioned earlier in the thread to see if it works for me yet.
New people have been more than welcomed into the group and have provided great input Keep up the great work Jimi. My only complaint would be I will have to invest in a better computer to get much flying time with this, I start off with 15 fps and it quickly takes me down. I am on a laptop.
Now off to find the post on the blue D model cockpit cure and will quote it to bring it back into light again, I did not see much in response to it. And not quite sure I understood it correctly.

Rick   

Victory103

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #564 on: January 08, 2015, 07:35:15 pm »
jimi, BZ job and moving in the right direction for sure. Thought I had a small +/- 3* excursion in yaw at 250kts, but it might of been the real Wx I was running, never noticed it again during the test flight. Any reported issues with AoA differences between the "E" bracket and the indexer? I'll dig back in the NATOPS as I've been busy trying to master a certain "Cat" lately around the boat.

I guess I missed it years ago, but was there ever a fix for the TCN bug?

Repaints are awesome, love the VFA-204 CoNA one, need to see if the repainter wants to do an adversary scheme they typically carry!
DUSTOFF
ARMY PROPS

Orion

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #565 on: January 08, 2015, 08:20:36 pm »
Good to hear pyroperson87 and Peter.  Also, Peter, I've always been curious: is there a story behind your username? :P

jimi08

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #566 on: January 08, 2015, 08:25:02 pm »
Gents,

Pyro:  Thanks for the feedback and compliments.

Orion:  Thanks for jumping in and fixing the issue.  I will download and check it out as well once I get home from work.

Rick:  Welcome and THANK YOU very much for the good words!  Since you have read this thread in full, you know that a lot of people have contributed to this project.  I will be sure to pass your compliments along.  Now to answer some of your questions.  As stated before, the Delta (Two-Seater) has kinda been put on the back-burner for a while for a number of reasons.  However, we have been tinkering with it lately.  It still has a ways to go, but I'll see what I can do in regards to releasing something updated.  No promises though.  In regards to the model being computer intensive, can you provide more detail please?  My initial hunch would lie in the extensive use of XML gauges in this aircraft, vs. the 2012 version that I created in the past.   Either way, I'll do some digging.

Victory:  Thanks for the input and remarks.  I too noticed an issue with "residual rudder trim" in certain situations, but thought that I fixed it.  I will check to see if I included the updated gauge in the latest release when I get home.  Can you please refresh my memory IRT the TACAN bug?

Pete:  Orion is correct.  Due to my lack of ability (the kind that ORION possesses...), I had to set the autoflap functionality to the gear instead of switch position to make it work.  Thanks to ORION, we were able to correct a great deal of things IRT the flaps.

Justin "Jimi" Hendrix
FSX Blue Angels
FSXBA F/A-18C Hornet Latest Download Link: http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,6944.msg117011.html#msg1

Azframer

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #567 on: January 08, 2015, 08:36:19 pm »


Repaints are awesome, love the VFA-204 CoNA one, need to see if the repainter wants to do an adversary scheme they typically carry!
Like this one?
It would be great to have that addition.
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b170/jason_schmus/1921475.jpg

hd764jvgd843

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #568 on: January 08, 2015, 09:19:07 pm »
Good to hear pyroperson87 and Peter.  Also, Peter, I've always been curious: is there a story behind your username? :P

Sorry to disappoint, but no - just the first one that randomly came to mind and wasn't taken yet.

pyroperson87

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Re: New FSXBA Hornet
« Reply #569 on: January 09, 2015, 01:51:35 am »
Random as in....you banged on the keyboard and had a username that wasn't already taken?  ;D
Pops