Author Topic: vLSO Beta release  (Read 818661 times)

Orion

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #825 on: January 12, 2014, 10:52:54 am »
Just curious, how did you implement the rollback?  After SURFACE RELATIVE GROUND SPEED goes to zero, transmit the TOGGLE_PUSHBACK event, wait, then toggle it back off?

Paddles

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #826 on: January 12, 2014, 05:00:16 pm »
Not quite...
I don't like the idea to use the pushback feature as the rollback, because the pushback's dynamic seems to follow the exponential rule, i.e. you toggle it on and it starts moving slowly, then accelerates more and more, and then keeps moving with the constant speed. But what I don't like about the pushback most of all is that it stops abruptly as soon as you toggle it off, just as if you engaged the parking brakes...
That's why I decided to use VELOCITY BODY Z, which follows somewhat biased Gaussian rule, i.e. smoothly accelerates and decelerates. This gives me full control over the process and the rollback looks more natural, just as what we can see on numerous carrier videos.
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pyroperson87

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #827 on: January 12, 2014, 05:47:41 pm »
Paddles you are god among men.  The work you do is just incredible.  I can't wait to see it in action!

Off topic a little bit, but with your FCLP sceneries the IFLOLS don't become visible until RIGHT before 3/4 of a mile, despite having my LOD radius maxed.  I'm assuming this is something on my end, but thought I would ask.

Also, how are the IFLOLS implemented?  Are they using the FSX halo.bmp?  My runway lights scalars are having no effect whatsoever on the ball or datum lights.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2014, 08:09:41 pm by pyroperson87 »
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SpazSinbad

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #828 on: January 12, 2014, 08:16:49 pm »
'pyro' heheheh. I think 'Paddles' has some 'lights' recommendations that are worth following. Also best to do FCLP at night - or at least dusk - so that the lights will be visible at about 1.5NM in my long ago experience testing FCLP and the new IFLOLS and light recommendations to the nth degree.  ;D
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Orion

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #829 on: January 13, 2014, 12:50:56 am »
Do you set VELOCITY BODY Z just once, then?  In my experience, it seems to have the effect of a short impulse, thereafter FSX continues to run its own internal simulation.

Paddles

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #830 on: January 13, 2014, 04:05:09 am »
...with your FCLP sceneries the IFLOLS don't become visible until RIGHT before 3/4 of a mile, despite having my LOD radius maxed.  I'm assuming this is something on my end, but thought I would ask.

Also, how are the IFLOLS implemented?  Are they using the FSX halo.bmp?  My runway lights scalars are having no effect whatsoever on the ball or datum lights.
The IFLOLS lights visibility range is set to 3700m, which is roughly 2nm. The FCLP pack vol.2 bundles a substitute to the default Halo.bmp and this texture is recommended to use with my FCLP sceneries. That was 3 years ago now, but I remember Spaz did numerous tests and finally we found that this texture would be a good compromise for both day and night practice. My current LOD is set to 3.5 and the lights work as intended.

...it seems to have the effect of a short impulse, thereafter FSX continues to run its own internal simulation.
Correct. That's why I set VELOCITY BODY Z in a sequence, following the aforementioned Gaussian rule. It's set about 4 times per second and runs smoothly.
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pyroperson87

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #831 on: January 13, 2014, 06:10:36 am »
Thanks Paddles, I got a copy of that halo and it's really nice.  I very much prefer it to Dante's light fix. 

Also, I figured out what was causing the problems with my ball not showing up.  Well, I sorta figured it out.  I was using REX4 textures, reverted back to my textures I had installed before and the problem was solved.  Not sure exactly WHAT in REX4 was causing it though. I'll have to install textures one by one and test them to see what's going on. Now I can see the ball at about 2NM like you said, and the clarity is enough that I can start flying the ball by about 1.3NM.  Had a great night flying tonight...it was the most I've done in a long time.  21 passes at KNRA and then 14 at the boat  :o
Pops

Paddles

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #832 on: January 13, 2014, 11:08:38 am »
21 passes at KNRA and then 14 at the boat  :o
Oh boy!.. That was quite a flying  ;D
« Last Edit: January 13, 2014, 11:28:46 am by Paddles »
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Paddles

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #833 on: January 13, 2014, 06:33:25 pm »
Guys,
I have a couple of questions about a FCLP refresher (or a period? do they differ, by the way?). How many touch-and-goes are there in a period? Does a period consist of both day and night passes or not? Say, 6 day T/Gs and 6 night T/Gs per a period/refresher?..
According to the table shown above a refresher is required only for day currency, so does this mean that only day FCLP is required? And what about night FCLP then?

Couldn't find any useable info on this and will be greatly appreciated if someone gives me a heads up...

Thanks in advance!
« Last Edit: January 13, 2014, 06:38:01 pm by Paddles »
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SpazSinbad

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #834 on: January 13, 2014, 07:16:44 pm »
Not being in the USN today nor have I ever been in the USN it can be difficult to say - however my understanding of the requirements would be that given a period of time when a pilot is not only not carrier qualified but may no longer be qualified on a particular carrier aircraft then there is a refresher period of flying that will include day FCLP and when 'refreshed' that pilot will then start night FCLP with usually getting the most 'bounces' as possible in any one night session. I'll guess there is a practical limit for any aircraft.

Day FCLP is a waste of time for an experienced pilot. New carrier pilots have to become comfortable with FCLP in daytime but then that is that. No more daytime FCLP. Why? Because there are too many cues during the day to either distract from ball flying or 'just make it too easy'.  ;D

For example during the day the runway and landmarks are visible along with the horizon. It is easy to 'deck spot' to get into the groove and stay there. In fact with experience, at the same field during the day, a pilot can simulate flying the ball without looking at it and do well. Not so at night. At night it is more difficult obviously so that the pilot has to concentrate on flying the ball and lineup on the teenytiny simulated carrier deck, and not crash. At the beginning night FCLP is a real chore but then it gets easier with practice, much the same as any form of flying, especially flying the ball. Probably after 6 or 7 approaches at night any pilot is tuckered out for that session anyway. Perhaps having a break by being hot refuelled, or changing to another aircraft that same night, is helpful but I would wager after two FCLP sessions at night for a total of say 14, most pilots would have had enough and probably regulations say the same thing [especially if that same pilot has flown during the day - often in preparation for the night FCLP session(s)]. Carrier pilots are humans too.  ;D

The reason the day/night FCLP circuit heights are different is also due to the 'danger nature' of night flying close to the ground. It ain't easy on a black moonless cloud covered night without external ground lights for some kind of orientation. It is just instrument flying until downwind visual with the lighted carrier box, abeam and then base turn from 1,000 feet AGL. This same circuit done during the day at NATOPS height is probably impossible at night. It is too easy to have some height wandering during the night FCLP circuit (within limits obviously). Remember during night time carrier pilots are not doing a visual circuit at sea. They carry out an instrument approach for good reason. One of the most difficult things I did for the first time was fly downwind on instruments at 1,000 feet after my first night deck landing attempting to listen to the LSO give a précis of my first night approach. They had not done it before either during FCLP or during day carrier circuits so that 'debrief' was a huge distraction and thankfully they never did it again. Anyway I was on my way at one thousand feet to be positioned for the next approach via CCA Carrier Controlled Approach (GCA from carrier) as I had been positioned for the first approach. Bloody hell it was black out there. I had NEVER been in such a black environment before at 1,000 feet.

Pilots will use the ball during the day to land at an airfield with a mirror/IFLOLS. If there is no such apparatus then the pilot will attempt to land in the same manner simulating such an approach.

Remember FCLP is supposed to be done at night. Day FCLP is useless once the basics mastered. When at sea during the day there are no visual cues except the horizon, the sea and the ship. Yes there are instruments today saying stuff but really the pilot needs to be visually able to position the aircraft around the ship. The chaps doing the SH$THOT breaks are probably not flying instruments. Once a pilot is competent and able to carry out day approaches regularly then they start to get SH$THOT but not before being really good at it anyway. Try being a SH$THOT newbie and there will be tears before teatime back at the beach.  ;D

Compare a test NIGHT FSX FCLP "height wandering up and down" with a dusk FCLP session (to get familiar with flying just as you see in the video - using only the HUD view as shown for the purpose of making the videos - try it - it is bloody difficult). Also I'm not familiar flying with a HUD. I'm old school flying visually (or non HUD instruments at night) looking at only the AoA Indexer and what else? MeatBall LineUp and AirSpeed (Optimum Angle of Attack). ;D  These videos made during testing for the PADDLES / FSXNAVYPILOT new IFLOLS and FCLP missions at Coupeville many moons ago now.

Having watched the night video again I must repeat that this is also a TEST of the calls by the LSO for accuracy and I was demonstrating as best I could for FSXNP that the calls sometimes were not accurate. YMMV. So rather than wave off from an erroneous call I continued because IMHO the approach was within limits. However in real life the LSO MUST BE OBEYED. OK?

And BTW the night conditions particularly for Mission 5 were carefully selected so that the moon was in an optimum position during a cloudless night to best make use of whatever cues can be seen. This was done to make life easier - bearing in mind mostly it ain't easy. I'll bet if one can master night FCLP then anything else is easy for sure. YMMV.



« Last Edit: January 13, 2014, 07:55:32 pm by SpazSinbad »
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SpazSinbad

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #835 on: January 13, 2014, 09:31:14 pm »
At the risk of being tedious the two FSX demo FCLP sessions via HUD only view have been rerendered together. Best viewed in HD or best quality available to you.

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GOONIE

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #836 on: January 13, 2014, 09:41:50 pm »
I'll agree with Spaz, that FCLP at night is definitely harder, which may be typically why most FCLPs occur at night or the evening hours, at least it is that way at Fentress. Daytime FCLP is easier, but is still used, maybe for guys new to the RAG, or if the night FCLP period is fully booked (shouldn't be a problem in FSX). During the day I hear VFA-106 RAG flights take off from Oceana, report Fentress in sight, then boogie on over for FCLP.

I thought a FCLP period was 8-10 passes (T/Gs), but I think it is at the discretion of the senior LSOs based on pilot performance and operational conditions. I agree with Spaz, that after 8 passes you must get pretty tired. Unfortunately, I have not heard nor read anything definitive about the FCLP refresher being required to be flown during the day or night, but I think the preference would be night time.

I asked my buddy who just CQ'd in the F/A-18C in Oct about FCLPs before he deployed in November. He said the ball flying of course is important during FCLP, but the two primary goals of FCLP work is to demonstrate to the LSOs that you can consistently get to a good 'start position' and also respond to LSOs commands promptly. As we all know the key to a good approach is a good start, which is largely an instrument maneuver as well as requiring stick and rudder skill. Since your airspeed is typically much faster during FCLPs (e.g. 30knots) when compared to landing on the boat (which is moving and usually has a wind over deck), it can make the ball flying during FCLP harder or not representative of the conditions when flying to the carrier, which I guess makes sense.  ::)

Anyways, just thought I would add this input.

Looking forward to the latest update Paddles!!!  We all need a little biased Gaussian rule rollback ;D

GOONIE
« Last Edit: January 13, 2014, 09:45:18 pm by GOONIE »
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pyroperson87

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #837 on: January 13, 2014, 10:39:04 pm »
I haven't been able to find any documentation regarding FCLP refreshers but for undergrad FCLP you fly NO LESS than 6 passes each FCLP event and they are ALWAYS flown in groups of 2 or 4, with UP TO 3 events PER DAY.

I have found some great PowerPoints from many of the training courses for SNA's:

If you go to Google and type in FCL XXXX (replace XXXX with 4 digit number) you can find almost every training syllabus from the start of FCLP through to completion from CNTRA.NAVY.MIL (you can also try IR XXXX, NFM XXXX, and FRM XXXX). Each PowerPoint presentation clearly indicates the requirements of each FCLP course on the "Syllabus Notes" and "Recommended Flight Conduct" pages.  There are also several other course types listed in the prerequisites including IR, NFM, and FRM classes.  This is by far the BEST resource I have found so far regarding undergraduate SNA training.


Of particular interest for vLSO purposes:
 - NFM 4101/4102 indicate that 12 night field carrier landings are required
« Last Edit: January 13, 2014, 11:06:29 pm by pyroperson87 »
Pops

pyroperson87

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #838 on: January 13, 2014, 11:18:09 pm »
Another REALLY good presentation I found is here:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&ved=0CC4QFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnatra.navy.mil%2Febrief%2Fdocuments%2F02_Training_Air_Wing_Two%2F03_MPTS%2520%28.167%29%2F17_Adv.%2520Jet%2520-%2520CQL%2FSUPPLEMENTS%2FSUPPLEMENTAL%2520DOCUMENTS%2FMID-STAGE%2520LECTURE.ppt&ei=pWPUUuutBKugsQTRoYDgCw&usg=AFQjCNFI-O6fbBY61gitTRKUQluP59m_Fg&bvm=bv.59026428,d.cWc

Has some REALLY great illustrations indicating some "benchmarks" (gouges) you can use when flying the pattern (this is again in the T-45)

And sorry for the long link, I don't know how to make it all pretty and say something like "click here!"  :D
Pops

SpazSinbad

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Re: vLSO Beta release
« Reply #839 on: January 14, 2014, 02:04:41 am »
Thanks for the gouge 'pyro'. Attached is the PPT made into a PDF of 59 pages (I'll see if the URL can be deciphered)....

Now attached is the NFM 4101 - 4102 XLS file made into a PDF (which I have yet to figure out what it means?).
http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&ved=0CDkQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnatra.navy.mil%2Febrief%2Fdocuments%2F01_Training_Air_Wing_One%2F02_MPTS%2520(.167)%2F11_MPTS%2520IJET%2520NFAM%2520(NFM)%2FKNEEBOARD%2FNFM%25204101-4102.xls&ei=HZDUUoXPIOWWiQey-YFo&usg=AFQjCNFKrbyWoaWgcv0NZ65H60G2qbI3Jg&sig2=DTCupgN0EKHMQm__EPfZYg&bvm=bv.59378465,d.aGc

I'm still adjusting.... here is the PPT for NFM 4101 - 4102 as a PDF (attached) with this text on one page:

SYLLABUS NOTES
A. FLY THESE EVENTS FROM THE FRONT COCKPIT

B. EVENTS SHALL TAKE OFF NO EARLIER THAN 30 MINUTES AFTER OFFICIAL SUNSET.

C. STUDENT MUST PERFORM ONE NIGHT BREAK AT THE FIELD IN BLOCK.

D. A MINIMUM OF 12 NIGHT FIELD CARRIER LANDINGS ARE REQUIRED IN BLOCK.

SOLO PPT made into a PDF attached.... (links are in the PDF).
« Last Edit: January 14, 2014, 02:32:02 am by SpazSinbad »
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