Sludge Hornet Modifications

[Afterburn93]

Hello FSDT...

The ever evolving Sludge Hornet release is just around the corner. We have thought up a few ideas that could push the hornet to the edge and make it just awesome. A few ideas recently tossed around include **true** HUD collimation VERY similar in nature to the Aerosoft F-16 with the same principles in mind, and weathered texture schemes to go along with it.

Truthfully, this HUD collimation idea is very possible, giving that Scott Printz did the F-16 HUD, and he also did the original HUD for JR's newer, realistic F-18 HUD. It is just the matter of the will power to make it happen. if there is anyone out there that wishes to pursue the idea, report to Sludge and/or myself and we can make it happen!

As for the weathered texture schemes, it really all depends on who wants to do it, just like the HUD. I haven't heard much debate at all over whether or not this can actually happen, but haven't heard many people asking for it either.

Attached are a few images Sludge asked me to post for you to view for reference to the way we want the Hornet's HUD to look.

Cheers,
A/B

[JamesChams]

You probably missed his post sometime back when he stated the the F/A-18 was now the *legal* property of Microsoft, which is why they WON'T make fixes/adjustments to it.   Its in these forums somewhere...

Well; we now have the VRS F/A-18E and hopefully the F and (E/A -)G versions.

[Sludge]

James...

I think he was talking about anyone, not just Virtuali or any former ACES team member, who can mod the HUD towards getting it collimated just like the F-16 HUD is?  From what Im understanding, its legal for any of us knuckleheads to do it, as long as the modifications still require the end-user to have FSX: Acceleration installed beforehand, and all work is properly credited.  Thats what the blueangels v1.1 hornet is, a wide-released modification of the default FSX Acceleration Hornet.

Well; we now have the VRS F/A-18E and hopefully the F and (E/A -)G versions.

Some of us dont have the VRS 'Bug, and some dont like it cause its a framerate killer that still doesnt work well.  Plus, the Bug's HUD is drawn w/fonts and lines that are too thick, and is anchored on the virtual pilot's viewpoint.  Thats why they are having problems with the HUD being viewable from outside the physical brackets.  From what I perceive, the aerosoft F-16 HUD is anchored about 5' in front of the aircraft's nose and just above, to give the illusion of "projecting" the HUD symbology towards infinity.  Now Im back here dedicating my FSX time to the Sludge Hornet, trying to get some ideas of how to get the F-18 HUD anchored the same way as the aerosoft HUD.  So we can get that collimated, projected HUD onto the Sludge Hornet.

if there is anyone out there that wishes to pursue the idea, report to Sludge and/or myself and we can make it happen!

whoa... easy there bulldog.  If anyone can make it happen, I dont want them reporting in to me... just would like their take on it, and fire away with any ideas they might have.  To have the aerosoft F-16 style projected, collimated HUD on the Sludge Hornet would just rock, so if anybody does have any ideas, please let me know.

Later
Sludge

[Sludge]

To all...

Check this video out, from 6:15 to 6:35, you can see the what I mean about the HUD and how it projects outward.

Also, look at the picture... the real world HUD doesnt have big, bulky numbers and lines like the VRS Bug HUD.  JR's HUD and the Aerosoft HUD have the right size lines/fonts as well.  Now if we could just get JR's HUD anchored in front of the plane, instead of on the HUD glass like the default is now, we'd have a winner!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HUD_view.jpg

Later
Sludge

[JamesChams]

James...

I think he was talking about anyone, not just Virtuali or any former ACES team member, who can mod the HUD towards getting it collimated just like the F-16 HUD is?  From what Im understanding, its legal for any of us knuckleheads to do it, as long as the modifications still require the end-user to have FSX: Acceleration installed beforehand, and all work is properly credited.  Thats what the blueangels v1.1 hornet is, a wide-released modification of the default FSX Acceleration Hornet.

I don't think you understand; it REQUIRES that you modify the model itself to get that effect...  I'll let Virtuali explain more... or, you can always ask Mr. Kok at Aerosoft about their F-16's Collimated HUD.

Well; we now have the VRS F/A-18E and hopefully the F and (E/A -)G versions.

Some of us dont have the VRS 'Bug, and some dont like it cause its a framerate killer that still doesnt work well.  Plus, the Bug's HUD is drawn w/fonts and lines that are too thick, and is anchored on the virtual pilot's viewpoint.  Thats why they are having problems with the HUD being viewable from outside the physical brackets.  From what I perceive, the aerosoft F-16 HUD is anchored about 5' in front of the aircraft's nose and just above, to give the illusion of "projecting" the HUD symbology towards infinity.  Now Im back here dedicating my FSX time to the Sludge Hornet, trying to get some ideas of how to get the F-18 HUD anchored the same way as the aerosoft HUD.  So we can get that collimated, projected HUD onto the Sludge Hornet.

...

Their FSX F/A-18 is the one I'm most interested in and their HUD is NOT created like Aerosoft's F-16, in fact its like the default Acceleration F/A-18's.  I think they'll be changing that with the next set of upates.

[Sludge]

James...

Seriously??  Well, if thats the case, then its probly a no-go for modifying the HUD.  That really sucks, cause Aerosoft F-16 has THE BEST HUD style, bar none.  Wouldve loved to see that on the Accel. Hornet, oh well, guess not... if what youre saying is true.  If anyone else has some info. or opinions about this, please chime in.

As far as the VRS HUD, some people dont like it, including me.  Its too thick and anchored wrong.  If the lines and fonts were smaller, and it were anchored somewhere on the aircraft, then maybe... but its not, it looks like a collimated, correllated MFD display simply put up on the HUD, IMO.

Here's what Im talking about to compare... when looking at these pics, if you think the VRS Bug HUD looks even close to how good the Aerosoft HUD does in relation to real world HUD of the 1st pic, lets just agree to disagree...

Later
Sludge

[Afterburn93]

You probably missed his post sometime back when he stated the the F/A-18 was now the *legal* property of Microsoft, which is why they WON'T make fixes/adjustments to it.   Its in these forums somewhere...

Well; we now have the VRS F/A-18E and hopefully the F and (E/A -)G versions.

Extending what Sludge mentioned, I put up this thread ONLY to discuss ideas going back and forth with Sludge's hornet, not to turn it into a court room. And yes, I apparently did miss something saying that it was "legally" Microsoft's property, I'm going to look for that post.

The VRS Superbug IS a framerate killer, and though I personally still fly it anyway, would like to have a plane that could always get better and still keep my framerate, which is so far what the Sludge hornet is.

Sludge,
All I meant by saying that is to let us know if it can happen, and if they want to help is all.

A/B

[virtuali]

I don't think you understand; it REQUIRES that you modify the model itself to get that effect...  I'll let Virtuali explain more... or, you can always ask Mr. Kok at Aerosoft about their F-16's Collimated HUD.

Yes, and no...

It would require to modify the model, if it was done like the Aerosoft F-16 which, if I understood the explanation, it's using a big projection plane, moved away from the view, in order to simulate collimation. Which, btw, it's something we did long ago in the Cloud9 Phantom gun collimator.

But, it might be possible to use an entierly C++ gauge-based approach, which means it can be used without changing the existing F-18 model. Of course, we can't simply modify the gauge we did for Microsoft (the whole F-18 code it's just a single gauge .dll which contains everything, including the HUD code) because, even that one is obviously now 100% MS property.

But we could theoretically create a whole new gauge from scratch, that contains only a new HUD and THIS could be legally released, since it wouldn't contain any of the original MS code.

However, I'd say it's unlikely we'll ever find the time to do something like this, considering all the other things we are involved at this moment.

Do you think it there might be a market for a generic HUD, maybe user-configurable, that can be used with any airplane ?

[Sludge]

Virtuali...

Much thanks for your reply!!  I understand that you have alot of other stuff on your plate and this would be a back-burner project AT BEST.

IF Microsoft ever gave the permission, would that make this process easier?  Would you be able to extend your knowledge of the model and HUD to all of us, so say someone such as JR might be able to integrate his HUD into the model?  Im going to ask them for permission to modify the HUD for just this fix, and although its a "lottery-ticket" shot, the worst they can do is say NO and then we are back to trying the C++ gauge method, right?

A/B...

No worries, it was just a very strong worded statement, thats all.  I know what you meant.  Thanks for putting this out there though...!!!

Later
Sludge

[Razgriz]

I don't think you understand; it REQUIRES that you modify the model itself to get that effect...  I'll let Virtuali explain more... or, you can always ask Mr. Kok at Aerosoft about their F-16's Collimated HUD.

Yes, and no...

It would require to modify the model, if it was done like the Aerosoft F-16 which, if I understood the explanation, it's using a big projection plane, moved away from the view, in order to simulate collimation. Which, btw, it's something we did long ago in the Cloud9 Phantom gun collimator.

But, it might be possible to use an entierly C++ gauge-based approach, which means it can be used without changing the existing F-18 model. Of course, we can't simply modify the gauge we did for Microsoft (the whole F-18 code it's just a single gauge .dll which contains everything, including the HUD code) because, even that one is obviously now 100% MS property.

But we could theoretically create a whole new gauge from scratch, that contains only a new HUD and THIS could be legally released, since it wouldn't contain any of the original MS code.

However, I'd say it's unlikely we'll ever find the time to do something like this, considering all the other things we are involved at this moment.

Do you think it there might be a market for a generic HUD, maybe user-configurable, that can be used with any airplane ?

I think a generic hud would be great.  If you could put it in any commercial aircraft, that would be even better.

[skimmer]

I can say for myself that the HUD is great the way it is. The biggest thing is you need is a dimmer control. To see aircraft in day time and carrier in IFR conditions at night better.

[virtuali]

I can say for myself that the HUD is great the way it is. The biggest thing is you need is a dimmer control.

Which HUD you are refering to ? The default Acceleration HUD always had a dimmer, and a night/day switch.

[skimmer]

This one-              NEW Realistic HUD for the Flight Simulator X Acceleration F/A-18 Hornet            
                           Version 1.0, November 29, 2009                                     
                   Jivko Rusev

[Sludge]

Virtuali...

Email sent to Microsoft, asking their one-time permission to modify the model to improve the HUD.  I still think we have a "lottery tickets" chance of getting permission, but might as well ask.  And on the chance that they actually say yes, do you know what we would need to do to get JR's HUD put on the model?  Or a realistic HUD that you made but got left off the final "default" Hornet?

Later
Sludge

[Afterburn93]

Virtuali...

Email sent to Microsoft, asking their one-time permission to modify the model to improve the HUD.  I still think we have a "lottery tickets" chance of getting permission, but might as well ask.  And on the chance that they actually say yes, do you know what we would need to do to get JR's HUD put on the model?  Or a realistic HUD that you made but got left off the final "default" Hornet?

Later
Sludge

Sludge,

What do you mean by getting JR's HUD put on the model? I thought that it already was. Regardless, it's pretty obvious that if we can't get that thing collimated, we are SOL.

I've been looking around to try and find weathered textures and ways to make them, but no such luck so far. The next guy would probably know much better than me about the matter anyhow in terms of how to make them. I just thought it would be a neat and unique thing to have on top of the cake.

Also, Sludge, I've been meaning to talk to you over skype about minor tweaks that I thought could be done, or if you've already made an attempt at them.

I will continue to see what can be done about the weathered textures, but i understand that in general, the HUD is the most important item on topic.

A/B