Author Topic: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list  (Read 8205 times)

romeocharlie

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JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« on: April 18, 2009, 08:00:14 pm »
I've been trawling through this forum for a while trying to find an answer to why I have continued to suffers CTDs with the FS9 version of FSDT JFK.

Is there any chance of putting a sticky at the top for all reported CTDs, possible causes and satisfactory solutions?

Then I could see what's happening with mine and apply a fix as necessary.

Many thanks

Rob

virtuali

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2009, 10:29:01 pm »
That's very simple: there's no such list, because there are no crashes that could be due to JFK. Usually, *every* report we ever had in the past, ended up the problem was elsewhere, like airplane, corrupted/missing AI textures, etc.

romeocharlie

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2009, 10:08:22 am »
Yes, I appreciate that there are no CTDs caused by your scenery, that is why, in the interests of trouble-shooting why I get CTDs in the vicinity of FSDT JFK, and not at Imaginesim KEWR or KLGA, I asked for a list of common FS-related errors and suggested fixes.

You cannot deny there are a number of posts on this forum about CTDs in the JFK area (be it on the ground, or on finals) and that there are any number of FS-related or OS-related causes - but there are also practical and useful tips on how to fix them.

I appreciate also you do not feel you have to support people's individual FS installations. I merely asked for a list of the common CTD causes and how they were fixed. For example - "CTD in FE.dll - it's an AI texture. Check your files are DXT3 - six 1,027kb" - for example.

I asked politely. I don't think it was an outrageous request. I currently own three of your sceneries, and will probably take advantage of your promotion and purchase the remaining two. They are terribly good, amazing pieces of work - but sometimes your support could be best described as "brusque".

Rob

virtuali

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2009, 11:23:49 am »
You cannot deny there are a number of posts on this forum about CTDs in the JFK area (be it on the ground, or on finals) and that there are any number of FS-related or OS-related causes - but there are also practical and useful tips on how to fix them.

Yes, there are a few post were user initially *though* the crash was casued by JFK but, if you read the post up to its conclusion, it usually always end up that the issue was something else, usually AI corrupted/missing textures, but even something else, like airplane, etc.

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I appreciate also you do not feel you have to support people's individual FS installations. I merely asked for a list of the common CTD causes and how they were fixed. For example - "CTD in FE.dll - it's an AI texture. Check your files are DXT3 - six 1,027kb" - for example.

If you look at the forum, you would see plenty of messages with tips and suggestions that are not specifically related to our products, and this is doable.

However, compiling and mantaining a list of general tips that might fix issue, is really outside the scope of what we are doing, which is developing and supporting our products. The issue is, 99% of the problems are usually caused by other stuff installed, but many times users notice it only after installing one of our product because, most likely, they never visited the default airport before, but the problem already existed.

We can't obviously test every possible addon out there, nobody can do that, the only thing we can do is to reply to individual questions and, of course, offering a Trial version (which we do), that is the best way to let users verify compatibility on THEIR own installation.

But, transforming ourselves into a general flight sim support site, with an easy to use list that would need to be kept updated, it's not what we do. There are plenty of websites around that are quite good to do this, were you can find specific forums (there's a CTD forum on Avsim, for example...) helping with any possible problem in flight sim.

Aerodynamic

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2009, 06:35:08 pm »
I posted my problem initially at Avsim and was told to subscribe to this forum and ask here.  I would advise that romeocharlie "spread the love" to try to get a solution.  That said, I posted here a couple days ago looking for a solution to "popping stutters" at JFK for FS9.  Virtuali took the time to respond to this thread, but seems to be ignoring my topic.

The fact is that I am starting to think that FSDT products are designed and throughly tested for FSX and then are ported over to try to make them work in FS9.  I don't think they have a good, widespread beta program for FS9.  There are way too many issues with the FS9 version of JFK, it seems.  I wish they would look into these issues, but it seems the book is already closed and they are not willing to do any more to their current FS9 lineup and it sounds like they will probably drop FS9 going forward.

My computer is plenty for FS9, but struggles with FSX with the big jets in big places.  So for now, it's FS9 or nothing until I spend $800 for a computer build.  I guess that means no FSDT scenery unless the support can offer up something other than "no one else has reported this" or "check another forum" and the like.

Respectfully,
Scott
« Last Edit: April 19, 2009, 06:59:23 pm by virtuali »

virtuali

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2009, 07:06:59 pm »
That said, I posted here a couple days ago looking for a solution to "popping stutters" at JFK for FS9.  Virtuali took the time to respond to this thread, but seems to be ignoring my topic.

Well, it happens when you reply to 2000 thousand post (just have a look at my post number), ONE might gone missing.

However, is NOT TRUE that we don't listen for suggestion for FS9 user, there are TWO fixes that has been posted to solve the stuttering on FS9, one for Geneva and one for KLAS, which appeared THE SAME DAY of the release!

Someone asked if we could post similar fixes for JFK and Zurich, and we'll surely do that, because this seems to be working.

And, of course, it simply confirms what we were saying from the start: there wasn't anything "strange" in the way our sceneries are made, it's just that FS9 can't handle the same amount of texture detail as FSX. We simply hit its limit, because nobody would have tought to put 160MB of textures in an airport *alone* back in 2003 when FS9 was released (top of the line video cards were 128MB back then)

So, we think to have solved the issue by releasing OPTIONAL fixes, that will lower the texture size. Because, obviously, some users might prefer living with some stuttering, in order to enjoy the best possible sharpness.


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The fact is that I am starting to think that FSDT products are designed and throughly tested for FSX and then are ported over to try to make them work in FS9.

"Starting to think" ??? We said that in the open too many times! We don't do ANY design work in FS9. We don't see the FS9 version during the developement cycle. Until 4 days ago, there was NO FS9 version to begin with! Some people in our team don't even have FS9 installed anymore, and never seen the FS9 version of the scenery they worked at...and one of them never saw FS9 at all, because it started flight sim developement with FSX...

We always said that, yet people find it hard to believe, because it might seem impossible that a scenery can be ported from scratch in 3-4 days, but this is what we do, and we repeated it many times, each time we were asked.

It's not secret we don't care for FS9, we think it's a dead platform, it costing us much more in support, because of too many problems with faulty 3rd party products, which sometimes are needed to improve basic FS9 aspects which are much better in FSX (like lack of mesh resolution, lack of roads/rivers details, etc.), and we clearly demonstrated that with OUR products (can't obviously speak for other ones...) FSX it IS usuable, EVEN as an airliner sim, because our big airports runs even better in FSX than FS9.

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There are way too many issues with the FS9 version of JFK, it seems.

This is just a unfunded comment. What are, exactly, those issues, apart the stuttering, which should be probably considered fixed, as soon we release a similar fix, as we did with Geneva and KLAS for FS9  ?



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I guess that means no FSDT scenery unless the support can offer up something other than "no one else has reported this" or "check another forum" and the like.

With the "check another forum" sentence, you entirely misunderstood my previous post, which was very specific about ONE thing: if someone would like to have a GENERIC advice on how to fix any crash problem NOT caused (repeat, NOT caused) by our products, and would like to find a well organized list of such issues, well, this is NOT the place.

We might give advice while in the middle of a thread that STARTED with the user THINKING it was a problem of our sceneries (which usually is not, 99% of the time), and this happened a lot.

Of course, if someone would point out a problem that happens at JFK or any other of our products, and is repeatable under every configuration (or, at least, the configuration under which it manifests itself is known), and is clearly *caused* by any of our product, in THIS case we'll obviously listen. Because, the patches and the fixes posted, clearly shown that, whenever a problem WITH the scenery is found, we ALWAYS issue fixes.

And of course, you shouldn't confuse bugs, which we usually fix, with design *choices* not in favor of FS9. That's an entirely different thing, if we decide to leave a feature off FS9 (for example, road traffic or animated jetways), it's NOT a problem of the scenery, it's a design choice and it's yours to take it or leave it, which is something you can do easily, considering we have Trial version for everything.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2009, 07:15:01 pm by virtuali »

Aerodynamic

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2009, 08:42:04 pm »
Virtuali-

Please don't consider my post as an ignition against your work and your products.  I appreciate the response, and a reply would have been all that was necessary to satisfy my post about the stuttering at JFK in FS9.  If you accidentally missed it, so be it.  I know you have a lot going on.  Please message me or reply about the fix that worked with other sceneries for FS9.  I would like to try it with JFK, and if it in fact helps, I would love to buy and use your scenery for FS9.

Thanks for the clarification.  I am new here and I don't yet own any of your products, and I haven't read through ALL threads in your forum.  But thank you for confirming my hypotheses about FS9 issues with the scenery (FS9 limitations or whatever) and that FSDT only develops for FSX and doesn't really care for FS9.

If people have discovered a fix that seems to have worked, such as smaller textures or whatever, can this be offered as a separate download from your web site?

Also, I digress, but I don't believe FS9 is "dead."  I own both FS9 and FSX and I think FSX is a very unpolished product.  And it won't ever be fully buffed since Aces is gone.  It is what it is, and it will be up to 3rd party folks such as FSDT and many others to make it something wonderful.  I think FS9 is much more stable and reliable, and it is a better fit for people across the board, regardless of the hardware they are using.  To each, his own.  I have gone back and forth between the two, I own lots of payware for each.  I spend hours tweaking display and cfg settings to try to get FSX to run smooth, and then I fly for like 45 minutes.  I always end up back with FS9, which looks almost as good as FSX in many regards and runs 3 times better.  So, "dead?"  No, not by a long shot for many people!  I can spend much more time enjoying actually flying in FS9.  But I respect your opinion.  If I had an i7 or a mega powerful C2Q, It would probably be possible to enjoy FSX as much as you and the design team.  I added up the cost to build something that would catch up to FSX and it would take about $800 just to do that.  I can't justify that in this economy when I have FS9 that runs like the wind with what I already have.  I hope you can respect my opinion just as I respect yours.

Thanks,
Scott

virtuali

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2009, 09:41:55 pm »
If people have discovered a fix that seems to have worked, such as smaller textures or whatever, can this be offered as a separate download from your web site?

The files for Geneva and KLAS are already here in the forum. Just allow us to do the same for JFK and the other scenery, and then we can put all of them in a more visible place, perhaps as sticky posts in each of their sections.

Aerodynamic

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2009, 12:07:29 am »
The files for Geneva and KLAS are already here in the forum. Just allow us to do the same for JFK and the other scenery, and then we can put all of them in a more visible place, perhaps as sticky posts in each of their sections.

That is great to hear.  I plan to try the LAS demo as well.  Looks phenomenal!  Keep us posted on any JFK or ORD adjustments/updates.  Thanks for your time and willingness to listen and help.

Scott

romeocharlie

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Re: JFK CTDs - comprehensive list
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2009, 02:46:43 pm »
Sir, after some exhaustive error-checking and analysis of my FS setup, graphics card settings and AI aircraft textures - plus resizing JFK bitmaps - I have (so far) not experienced a CTD in the area of KJFK.

I have also re-activated Imaginesim KEWR and KLGA and not suffered any noticeable performance issues.

Thanks to your insistence on looking elsewhere other than your scenery I appear to be in the clear. Many thanks for your support, suggestions and advice. I now have a fantastic JFK scenery and am ready for my first transatlantic flight.

Rob