New Fuel track positioning

[bcarter]

Hi there,

Yesterday I downloaded the latest complete GSX Installer because I was having trouble with the previous version. I set up the PMDG B744 in FSX at the gate in Heathrow (Aerosoft) to see if the same problem was happening and thankfully both cargo unloading conveyors were present. There was usually only one and the missing one unloaded the containers in space!

I was curious about the new fuel truck so I activated it. I have never seen this operation before so I didn't know what to expect. I was surprised to see the fuel trucks (3 of them, one after the other) parking under the belly of the aircraft instead of under the wings etc. Is this a normal procedure of is something wrong?

Regards
Brian

[virtuali]

The PMDG 747 is not already pre-configured with a refuel point. You must add it yourself, using the GSX airplane configuration editor.

[bcarter]

Thanks for the info about the refueling position. I was able to change it to a more appropriate point under the wing of the aircraft.

Now there is another issue, I get the message: “Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel”. I load up the required amount of fuel in the PMDG fuel area. The tanker is now sitting there asking over and over to: “Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel”.

It worked okay when the fuel tanker was in the belly of the aircraft.

Any ideas?

[virtuali]

Now there is another issue, I get the message: “Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel”. I load up the required amount of fuel in the PMDG fuel area. The tanker is now sitting there asking over and over to: “Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel”.

That's not an issue. It's because you haven't read the manual...follow the example in the manual about the PMDG 737, which should work the same with the 747: when you have a plane that has a custom fuel system ( I guess you configured it as such ), but NO progressive refueling simulation on its own, the moment you see the "Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel" is the moment you must add fuel (using whatever means the 3rd party airplane provides)., because it's from there that GSX calculates how much fuel you added, by comparing the quantity you had *before* that message, and waiting for any sudden increases that happens from that moment onward.

Any changes applied to the fuel while the truck is arriving, before you see the "Please use the refueling system... " message, will be entirely ignored.

It worked okay when the fuel tanker was in the belly of the aircraft.

No, it wasn't really ok.

It was simply not configured and, since the default configuration is to have GSX controlling the refueling directly (like a default airplane), it worked differently. Now that you configured it, and (correctly) set it as a plane that does't use the default fuel system, it's expecting you to use it as such, which is the workflow explained in the GSX manual in the PMDG 737 example.

[crauds]

Following your advice to the OP, I reconfigured my PMDG B744, moving the position of refueling out onto the right wing.  My intention was to load to 228,000 lbs.  I made sure my current load was 30,000 lbs and called for refueling.  The truck now positioned correctly under right wing and attendant attached the coupling.  I waited until "Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel" appeared and THEN went into my PMDG fuel menu and inserted 228.000 and saved it.  I waited but again the "Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel" appeared.  I checked and my fuel request was correctly set in the PMDG fuel menu but I am stuck with the message that keeps flashing and thus no fuel is being loaded.  It worked fine before I configured the aircraft in the editor but as OP stated it was visually bringing the truck under the fuselage instead of the right wing.  All I changed was the position of the fuel input.  Help!

[virtuali]

I waited until "Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel" appeared and THEN went into my PMDG fuel menu and inserted 228.000 and saved it.  I waited but again the "Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel" appeared.

The only explanation for this, is the PMDG 747 behaves differently than the 737, so even if the fuel is set, it's not "really" set in the simulation, so GSX cannot detect a fuel increase.

I'll try to check it, since I believe I bought the plane years ago, but it has been a while since I had it installed.

It worked fine before I configured the aircraft in the editor but as OP stated it was visually bringing the truck under the fuselage instead of the right wing.  All I changed was the position of the fuel input.  Help!

I'm sorry, but just changing the position cannot affect this. In addition to moving the fuel position, you must also have changed the flag that controls if the plane has a custom fuel system.

[crauds]

Not sure which flag you mean, Umberto.  I checked my "airplanes" directory under "virtuali" and all my aircraft have refueling flag set to "0" in gsx.cfg file.  The only thing in that file that changed was the position of the refueling point.  Where is the flag determining custom fuel system located?

[virtuali]

Where is the flag determining custom fuel system located?

The option that says "Shows FSX Fuel and Cargo dialog during refueling".

If it's enabled, the refueling flag int the gsx.cfg will be 1, so the plane will behave as a default plane, if it's 0, it will work as a plane with a custom refueling system so, in the case of the 747, it should be used like the 737 in the manual.

[crauds]

That is what I thought and indeed I verified that it is set just like the PMDG B737.  I am going to change the refueling point back to the default again and determine if the refueling algorithm performs correctly as it did before I moving the refueling point.  That is all I can think of I my end.

[virtuali]

I've installed the 747, and configured it with a refuel point as indicated. No problems whatsoever, and GSX correctly recognized the change of fuel.

This was the exact sequence of operations, which matches what is explained on the manual (similar to the 737 example, just the 747 has a menu to load fuel, instead of the FMC)

- The plane was initially set as 1/3 fuel, using the fuel preset in the PMDG fuel menu.

- I called the GSX refueling

- When the message "Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel" came, I opened the PMDG Fuel menu again, selected 2/3 and clicked the "Apply Now" button.

- The fuel quantity indicator changed to show the new quantity, and the GSX fuel truck started the refuel progressively, since I had the "Always refuel progressively" option enabled.

Find attached the GSX.CFG file I'm using.

[virtuali]

I am going to change the refueling point back to the default again and determine if the refueling algorithm performs correctly as it did before I moving the refueling point. 

Don't bother doing this. As I've said, the position itself won't have ANY effect on it. Unless you set it lower than 3.45 mt. but then you would get the old fuel truck instead.

[crauds]

Thanks, Umberto.  Your cfg works!

[crauds]

The first time I used your config file for the PMDG B744 it seemed to work but when I restarted FSX and set up the same aircraft again, the request "Please use the refueling system of your airplane to refuel"  just kept repeating.  I checked the aircraft settings in the editor and found that the vertical component had changed.  I went back to the cfg file and found that it had subtracted 3.54m from its initial value.  I reset it back to 0.73 which is according to the cfg file you uploaded to us in this thread.  I then closed down and restarted FSX.  This time, however, it did not even send the large tanker but only the old shell truck and it went to the left side, totally ignoring my fuel point coordinates.  I went into edit airplane in the GSX menu and found that it was displaying coordinates correctly but when I then checked the gsx.cfg file I found again that it had subtracted 3.54 from the vertical coordinate so instead of having the 0.73 it had -2.81.  This must be causing the small truck but why won't it at least go to the fuel point on the right wing?  I then tried the PMDG 737-800wl and found that it was also changing the vertical component.  I have FSX on Vista 64 if that has any bearing.  I had not extensively tested GSX before the last update.  I only used it once on the PMDG B738 and it seemed to work perfectly.  I have subsequently recopied your config file again into the PMDG747-400 directory, completely rebooted and restarted FSX but can't get it to work again.  Why did it work at first?  ... a mystery for after Christmas!

[crauds]

Umberto, I do believe now that you had originally positioned the refuel point for the B763 to 15.79 -3.55 4.27 but  GSX subtracted 3.54 from the vertical to determine what sized truck to send.  But in so doing, it saved that result to the gsx.cfg file leaving it with a corrupted vertical value the next time it is accessed.  The file you uploaded had a vertical of only 0.73 and that perhaps would have caused the anomalies. I think the same thing may have happened to the PMDG B737-800wl gsx.cfg, since it also has become non-functional when I tried it again.  Hope that helps narrow down the issue I am experiencing.

[virtuali]

Umberto, I do believe now that you had originally positioned the refuel point for the B763 to 15.79 -3.55 4.27

I'm not sure what a 767-300 has to do with this...

GSX is not "subtracting" anything. The coordinates in the GSX.CFG file might not be what you expect them to be, because they are NOT based on ground, they are based on the airplane center of balance!! So, a 0 doesn't mean "on ground", it means somewhere in the belly of the airplane.

The coordinates are stored like as relative heights to the center of the airplane so they will always be valid, regardless how the actual load of the plane (which affects the plane height) were when you edit it. Since the plane is momentarily placed in Slew mode when editing, it's height will always be the same. Of course, when you *use* the plane, the height used will be the actual one so, with coordinates being relative, it will always work.

The editor, instead, will ADD to the relative coordinates, the plane actual height, so what you see in the editor, is what you expect to see (relative to ground), which IS different from what you see in the GSX.CFG.

So, I can only repeat and confirm, there's NO problem whatsoever with both the refueling and the 747, and the GSX.CFG file I posted is correct. The only possible explanation for not working, is that you haven't set it in the correct folder. There are many variants of the 747, so you must place it in each and every folder.

And of course, DO NOT forget the priority rules AND the UAC-compliant read/write rules:

- If you place it in the main Airplane folder under FSX\Simobjects\Airplanes\AIRPLANE_NAME, this will take precedence over the internal GSX data

- If you place it in the folder with the airplane name, under %APPDATA%\Virtuali\GSX\AIRPLANE_NAME it will take precedence over BOTH the internal GSX data AND a GSX.CFG file in the FSX\Simobjects\Airplanes\AIRPLANE_NAME

- If you place it in the main Airplane folder under FSX\Simobjects\Airplanes\AIRPLANE_NAME, but you then EDIT IT with the GSX airplane editor, a NEW GSX.CFG will be created under %APPDATA%\Virtuali\GSX\AIRPLANE_NAME, and THIS new file will also take precedence over it. This in order to comply with Windows UAC rules, that don't allow applications to write any settings under the C:\Program Files folder.

So, be sure you are not being confused about all this issues. Yes, I know it's best I'll add the 747 directly to the GSX internal database...