FSDreamTeam forum
General Category => Unofficial F/A-18 Acceleration Pack board => Topic started by: burner12 on May 21, 2009, 03:31:34 pm
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I have seen Tomcats and hornets do this maneuver many tim es but in FSX with the F-18 I can't do it. What it is is a roll that makes the plane roll inverted then level off at about 1 or 2000ft below where he was. So when you see it it isn't an aerilon roll. There is a large gap in between the 2 altitudes the one where he was and then the one where he levels off at. But in FSX all I do is just aerilon rolls. and the closets I've come to doing one of these is when I take the plane and roll it in a large roll. But that isn't the maneuver. Can somebody tell me what I'm doing wrong?
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Computer not easy to use at moment but later I'll GOOGLE 'Barrel Roll'. Is that what you think you are seing/ trying to emulate? It can be a difficult aerobatic trick to do well. Here is a start: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barrel_Roll
"Aviation
In aviation, the maneuver includes a constant variation of attitude in all three axes, and at the midpoint (top) of the roll, the aircraft is flying inverted, with the nose pointing at a moderate angle to the general path of flight. The term "barrel roll" is frequently used, incorrectly, to refer to any roll by an airplane (see aileron roll), or to a helical roll in which the nose remains pointed generally along the flight path. In fact, the barrel roll is a specific and difficult maneuver; a combination of a roll and a loop. One advantage of the barrel roll over the aileron roll is that it is possible to maintain positive "g" force throughout the maneuver."
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http://www.fulldeflection.com/index.php/manoeuverscatalogue/42-catalogue/48-barrel-rolls
"The Barrel roll is a combination between a loop and a roll. You complete one loop while completing one roll at the same time. The flight path during a barrel roll has the shape of a horizontal cork screw. Imagine a big barrel, with the airplanes wheels rolling along the inside of the barrel in a cork screw path. During a barrel roll, the pilot always experiences positive Gs. The maximum is about 2.5 to 3 G. The minimum about 0.5 G."
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http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070619134019AA384Bm
"A barrel roll is a coordinated maneuver done on a parabola. The aircraft is first placed in a shallow dive to gain airspeed then as the nose is brought up through the horizon left aileron and left rudder are applied smoothly, coordinated back pressure is maintained until inverted then released slightly, as the plane continues to roll and the nose drops through the horizon aileron and rudder are slowly brought back to the neutral position, back pressure is applied slightly to bring the nose back to the horizon. Done correctly the whole maneuver is kept in positive G. The control inputs are constant feed and released smoothly throughout this maneuver performed about a fixed point on the horizon.
To get a visual idea of what the maneuver looks like take a threaded bolt and look at it from the end, consider the center line of the bolt as your point on the horizon now follow the path of the threads as they go around the bolt. This is the same flight path taken in a barrel roll you enter and exit slightly of course in relationship to the center line of the maneuver. Watch and learn here."
(T6 Training Video. Barrel Rolls)
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YaddaYaddaYadda with diagrams for BFM (Basic Fighter stuff):
"A compilation made using original videos from FA-18 Hornet 3.0 flight simulator game.
It cover the following topics:
Basic Fighter Maneuvers
Pursuits
Guns defense
Missile defense and evasion
Hi yoyo
Low yoyo
Lag roll
Lead, pure and lag pursuit"
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For a barrel roll to the left pull the stick back left(full left airleron and full back on the stick) and apply full left rudder. You can also adjust more or less back stick/left or right roll and rudder to increase or decrease the diameter of the barrel roll. Handy for BFM to reduce speed but maintain energy in the fight. ;)
This is an aileron roll
Barrel roll
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subs17, your description (with rudder) is not a barrel roll for a jet (which will seldom use rudder - if ever). The exception to rudder use may be in BFM (see video above). I have no argument with what you describe as a legitimate BFM but it is just not a barrel roll.
A barrel roll is a smooth maneuver - not a violent one that you describe. A prop aircraft will perhaps need to use rudder but that is the nature of a prop flying. I guess we both need to know if we are on the right track according to burner12. Mostly in jet aircraft - except for airshows or testing purposes the jet is flown to does things 'all mixed in together' according to whatever is required at that time. It would be handy if burner12 can direct us to a video of what he is describing.
Click graphic below for an animation of a barrel roll.
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It depends on the aircraft type as to who uses rudder for a barrel roll some aircraft types use it. BTW heres a cool fighterpilot song.
;D
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Yeah I guess helos need rudder for their barrel roll. ;D
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I think he is talking about a normal roll in which you let the plane lose altitude instead of trying to keep it. Something very often used in movies. It seems a lot of altitude when seen from another aircraft that is flying straight and level, but not near to 1000 or 2000 feet. Maybe your appreciation of altitude loss is exagerated, burner12? Or is it another thing what you try to explain?
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You may be looking for the "Split S"
From Wiki... The Split S is an air combat maneuver mostly used to disengage from combat. To execute a Split S, the pilot half-rolls his aircraft inverted and executes a descending half-loop, resulting in level flight in the exact opposite direction at a lower altitude.
The Split S is taught to be used in dogfighting when the pilot has the opportunity to withdraw from battle. Contrary to popular belief, this maneuver is almost never used to evade target-locked air-to-air missiles. However, it can be an effective tactic to prevent an enemy behind (between eight o'clock and four o'clock positions) from gaining a missile lock-on while one is disengaging from a fight.
The Split S maneuver is contrasted with the Immelmann turn, which is an ascending half-loop that finishes with a half-roll out, resulting in level flight in the exact opposite direction at a higher altitude. The Split S is also called a reversed Immelmann turn, or can be listed with a hyphen as Split-S.
Back to me:
To execute a Split-S climb out to at least 2,500 ft AGL (although 20,000 ft is much more forgiving) and increase speed to about 450-500 kts. Roll the aircraft over using left-full stick. Then level off (belly up) and cut throttle. Pull back on the stick hard and hold it until you are flying level on the horizon.
Good Luck!
Wookie