FSDreamTeam forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: kikigey89 on October 13, 2016, 01:29:19 pm
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Hey guys,
In preparation for Cross the Pond on VATSIM I bought KDFW, installed it and first everything was working flawlessly.
Yesterday I started some long haul tests, just to be sure I won't expect some weird issues during CTP.
After a few hours of flight I experienced a CTD with a problem in ntdll.dll. I restarted the sim and tried again. Again a CTD after some time.
I did a lot of testing (closing apps, deactivating modules in P3D) and found out that if I delete the couatl entry from exe.xml I do not get CTDs. If I include that entry. the CTDs reappear.
I already reinstalled Addon Manager (standalone), Couatl (via Live Update) and reinstalled GSX - No success :(
Do you have any ideas?
Best regards,
Chris
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Couatl.exe, by itself, cannot cause a crash in the sim, since it's an external executable so, by definition, it doesn't have any chance to affect the simulator.
However, there's a longstanding issue in P3D, which has been reported many times to LM, that P3D is "leaking" Simconnect exceptions caused by OTHER addons, into other addons that don't have anything to do with the original exception error.
See a description here, coming from SODE's author who experienced the same issue: another module caused errors, and they were leaking into SODE, so it looked like SODE was the cause, but it wasn't:
http://www.fsdreamteam.com/forum/index.php/topic,13668.msg105608.html#msg105608
So, it's possible that, after a long flight, all these exceptions might eventually cause an OOM, which is usually what a crash in ntdll.dll means.
Could you try ANOTHER test ? Disable ALL other 3rd party modules *except* the FSDT ones in the DLL/EXE XML files ?
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Could you try ANOTHER test ? Disable ALL other 3rd party modules *except* the FSDT ones in the DLL/EXE XML files ?
I did, still the same :( Only bglmanx.dll in dll.xml and couatl.exe in exe.xml.
What I forgot to say: FSUIPC automatically saves a scenario every 5 minutes. I'm currently always testing with the last scenario it saved this morning before the CTD. It is completely reproducible.
So usually I get a CTD with that scenario within 5 minutes.
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I did, still the same :( Only bglmanx.dll in dll.xml and couatl.exe in exe.xml.
P3D V3 has two set of XML files: some addons use the ones in %APPDATA%, other use the ones in %PROGRAMDATA%. Be sure you disable everything else (except our modules) from BOTH locations.
What I forgot to say: FSUIPC automatically saves a scenario every 5 minutes. I'm currently always testing with the last scenario it saved this morning before the CTD. It is completely reproducible. So usually I get a CTD with that scenario within 5 minutes.
You should disable everything for the test, which includes FSUIPC.
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P3D V3 has two set of XML files: some addons use the ones in %APPDATA%, other use the ones in %PROGRAMDATA%. Be sure you disable everything else (except our modules) from BOTH locations.
You should disable everything for the test, which includes FSUIPC.
Good point, I forgot of the other set. Now FSUIPC is also disabled but still the same, still CTD.
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Good point, I forgot of the other set. Now FSUIPC is also disabled but still the same, still CTD.
Which airplane you used ?
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My own one (for my home cockpit), I made the flight dynamics, exterior model is Blackbox A330. Default FSX A321 cockpit.
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My own one (for my home cockpit), I made the flight dynamics, exterior model is Blackbox A330. Default FSX A321 cockpit.
So you are now running your home cockpit without any modules ?
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Exactly, I stripped it down to only the FS computer, without any external apps and just the dll and couatl.
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Exactly, I stripped it down to only the FS computer, without any external apps and just the dll and couatl.
Do you have an easy sequence to reproduce it with a default airplane ? I have just made a takeoff, a turn around the airport, then landed, taxied to Gate C6, called the GSX docking system, docked and turned off the engines, and I couldn't see any problems.
It took about 10 minutes, but you said it should appear in 5 minutes ? I'm using P3D 3.4 with the default B737 copied from FSX.
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I attached my save file, I just climb to 37000 ft, heading 300 and speed 270. Should occur within 5 minutes, if nothing happens after 10-15 minutes then you do not have that issue.
I'm not sure, but I had the feeling yesterday that it appears when coming closer to the coast. The first time it happened south of Greenland and the second time 93 NM off the coast of Newfoundland.
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Just a quick update as my tests continue: I deactivated my RAM disk and now it seems to be stable. Couatl is usually also on the RAM disk (the entire fsdreamteam folder) and maybe some part of the RAM is corrupted. As I installed KDFW my FSDT folder size increased which may forced Couatl to be written in a corrupted section.
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Ok, I did a lot more tests. Memtest (6 passes) could not find any RAM problem.
Now I reactivated everything in exe.xml and dll.xml and the only thing which is different now, is that Couatl is NOT running on the RAM disk anymore. However all my FSDT sceneries are on the RAM disk. No problem anymore.
Do you have an idea what's wrong? I had Couatl on the RAM disk for 2 years now, without any issue. However after KDFW install it doesn't like the RAM disk anymore.
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Do you have an idea what's wrong? I had Couatl on the RAM disk for 2 years now, without any issue. However after KDFW install it doesn't like the RAM disk anymore
No idea but, it's clear from your tests the RAM disk configuration was a problem, and now you removed it, the problems went away
KDFW installation cannot have anything to do with this, since they just install the scenery and don't make any change to your system configuration, let alone something that might affect a RAM disk ( like a driver, for example ) so, fact you noticed it only after installing it, was only a coincidence.
In any case, using a RAM disk for Couatl doesn't make much sense, since the only thing that you might gain would be a slight decrease in loading time, but once it's in memory, it will be the same, since it's not a disk-intensive program. Its files are also very small, you can probably fit the whole GSX code in less space than a single 1024x1024 scenery texture...
Couatl it's a Python interpreter and, all the Python files that makes up for a program like GSX or the script that handles the scenery, for example, or the scripts that generates the scenery, are first loaded in memory, and then executed from there. A proof for this, is that you can even *remove* a program file, and the program will still continue to work, until you restart it. If the program execution at run time was in some way dependent on the filesystem it's stored on, you wouldn't be able to remove it so easily, and you would see an "access denied" error, like when you try to remove an active .BGL while the sim is running.
So, by running it from a RAM disk, you don't really gain anything, perhaps a *slightly* faster loading time (but it won't be probably noticeable compared to a fast M2 drive), but no actual performance gains.
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The only reason why Couatl was on the RAM disk was that it was much easier just writing one line of batch script, copying just the entire FSDT folder instead of each single scenery :-)
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The only reason why Couatl was on the RAM disk was that it was much easier just writing one line of batch script, copying just the entire FSDT folder instead of each single scenery :-)
Sure but, since RAM is quite scarce resource, maybe with the above info you might decide to optimize it better for other things that will gain more (textures, for example, are loaded/unloaded at all times).
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Again a CTD :(
Yesterday and during the night I could fly 2 long hauls without any problem, now again a CTD...
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Are you still running with a RAM disk ?
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Yes, only Couatl now not on the RAM disk anymore.
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Yes, only Couatl now not on the RAM disk anymore.
So, what's happen if you disable it entirely ?
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I tested it the last two days. The remainder of the flight, the return flight and again the same two flights yesterday no problem occurred. So almost two days and four long hauls without any issue.
Today it crashed again, almost at the same position as mostly. I started P3D again, continued the flight and when after 10 minutes nothing happened, I reloaded the scenario (which was saved around 4 minutes before it crashed). The scenario loading worked and the message "Regenerating airport cache" appeared. Then couatl.exe crashed with a message and P3D crashed (to desktop) without any error. Windows error log shows a crash in api.dll. I tried it again and first the scenario worked without any problem. Then I loaded it again when after 15 minutes no crash occurred and again the same happened. Loading worked, the aircraft started flying. "Regenerating airport cache" appeared, couatl.exe crashed and P3D crashed to desktop.
That and also the fact that it always crashed close to the coast (mostly around Scotland, once around Greenland and a few times 90 NM off the coast of Newfoundland) makes me thinking if there might be a problem with the airport cache or at least something linked to that?
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Now it crashed again after the second loading but this time immediately after the message that the airport cache has been loaded successfully appeared.
I think I will try to reinstall all FSDT, FBS, Couatl and Addon Manager stuff. How can I make sure that I uninstalled ALL parts of it (including all directories)?
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I think I will try to reinstall all FSDT, FBS, Couatl and Addon Manager stuff. How can I make sure that I uninstalled ALL parts of it (including all directories)?
An total clean reinstall will require to remove these folders:
%PROGRAMDATA%\Virtuali\Couatl
%APPDATA%\Virtuali
Note that, removing %APPDATA%\Virtuali will reset all your GSX preferences, including all your eventual airport/airplane customizations, so you might want to backup it first, if you did any.
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If you have mytraffic installed then thats the reason, ntdll.dll
disable miltraffic.bgl
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No traffic addon installed :(
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Sorry for the delay, I was busy with a lot of other things but 2 weeks ago I started testing again. In a lot of tests I could confirm that I get only crashes with couatl.exe enabled in exe.xml. Once I disable it OR kill the process after P3D start, I have no issues at all. I browsed a lot on the internet to find a reason for the crash in ntdll.dll. I tried all things I could find (starting P3D as admin, updating graphics card driver and around 10 other things) and I also uninstalled (including deleting remaining files/folders) and reinstalled Addon Manager and Couatl. No change at all. I also checked the GSX log, nothing special in there...
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Try installing your C++
http://forums.flightsimlabs.com/index.php?/topic/11644-resolved-a320-crashes-to-desktop-with-ntdlldll-error/&do=findComment&comment=93369
Have a look there. I hope it helps.
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Sorry for the very late reply, I had a lot of other things to do in the meantime. I tried your suggestion but it did not help. Somehow it appears I have less crashes than in February.
Today I decided to fly a leg in the U.S. after a long time without a U.S. flight (also due to this issue). I flew from KIAD to KJFK. During pushback I saw something weird happening: The large buses at KIAD were frequently jumping a little bit backwards. During the pushback I got maybe around 3 short freezes during which the FS sound got silent and I could see the trees around the airport disappearing and reappearing. After pushback I had no more issues.
After landing at JFK I selected my gate with the GSX menu. But no ground service appeared and on the blocks I checked which gate GSX was thinking I was at. It was a totally wrong gate but I selected the correct gate which I discovered after a Couatl restart. So I got the feeling that something with Couatl is wrong on my machine. I started thinking what other issues I noticed:
- The first pushback always works fine (except for this KIAD issue now) but during the second pushback the marshaller does not walk anymore but hovers over the ground without a leg animation. Every few seconds I can see a short and quick animation which then stops immediately again. I never really thought about this but might this be one single issue?
Do you have any idea what can cause this?
Chris
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during the second pushback the marshaller does not walk anymore but hovers over the ground without a leg animation. Every few seconds I can see a short and quick animation which then stops immediately again. I never really thought about this but might this be one single issue?
We still haven't found what's causing this but, in the mean time, always Restart Couatl before doing the 2nd leg of a flight.
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We still haven't found what's causing this [...]
Is this a known issue? Just trying to figure out, which is a known bug and which is almost exclusively my problem (a few on the P3D forum also have the ntdll crashes inflight, for at least one other user, disabling couatl.exe also helped).
Is there any special version of a C++ redist that Couatl needs? Something else that should be installed together with Couatl but maybe it didn't on my PC?
Chris
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Is this a known issue? Just trying to figure out, which is a known bug and which is almost exclusively my problem
I'm referring only to the lack of animations on the 2nd flight of the session
(a few on the P3D forum also have the ntdll crashes inflight, for at least one other user, disabling couatl.exe also helped)
Couatl.exe, being an .exe, cannot possibly crash the whole sim so no, it's not possible that disabling Couatl would have helped, especially in the middle of a flight, when it's not doing anything.
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I'm referring only to the lack of animations on the 2nd flight of the session
Yes, but this is a known issue?
Couatl.exe, being an .exe, cannot possibly crash the whole sim so no, it's not possible that disabling Couatl would have helped
Well, but it definitely helps disabling it. That's the only thing which is 100% reproducible (and with 100% I really mean 100% so far). Since February I'm flying with killing Couatl after pushback. Never got any error since then on any flight and I flew a lot of those long hauls which always create that error. The error message I get is related to an error in the heap but I have no more idea (except of reinstalling everything, including Windows).
especially in the middle of a flight, when it's not doing anything.
It only happens when I get closer to coasts from the ocean side, almost all the time around 80 NM. Basically at the point what I think should be a good time for apps to load relevant airport data.