FSDreamTeam forum
FS9 support => Hawaiian Airports support FS9 => Topic started by: Kelleymoe on July 20, 2011, 02:20:22 am
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What am I doing wrong? As you can see, the runway at PHOG is disappearing as I taxi down the runway. It's ok if I start at PHOG, but I have problems if I try and land. This issue last until I exit the runway. However, everything is fine at PHKO. I had a similar problem with Vol 1. PHLI had this problem, but PHTO was fine. I think you fixed it with a patch.
I forgot to add, I don't have any other Hawaii sceneries installed and I'm not using UT. The only add-on scenery activated in my scenery directory is Hawaiian Airports Vol 2.
Here's the photos from inside the plane at PHOG:
imageshack.us/photo/my-images/849/phog.jpg/ (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/849/phog.jpg/)
and the second one is the outside looking down (same location).
imageshack.us/photo/my-images/8/phog1.jpg/ (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/8/phog1.jpg/)
Thanks,
Mike
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Are you using the Mesh settings as suggested in the manual, which is Complexity at 100 and Resolution at 10m/pixel (all the slider to the right on terrain option apart water)
Tell us about your hardaware: graphic card driver installed Ati/nvidia, cpu and ram.
If anyone else please report with hardware spec.
Thank you
Fabrizio
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Having the same issue.
ATI HD 4650 1 GB
i7 920 Processor
9GB DDR3 RAM
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Try with the attached files, the larger AFCAD should be in the fsdreamteam\PHOG\scenery folder, the smallest one, in the main Scenery\World\Scenery folder
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Installed those and still having the same issue.
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Hello...i purchase hawaiian airports vol2 for FS9 and i have the same problem in PHOG,about to land ,the runway vanish, disappears, the two bgls above not solved this problem for me,i wait for a fix please ;)
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Hello...i purchase hawaiian airports vol2 for FS9 and i have the same problem in PHOG,about to land ,the runway vanish, disappears, the two bgls above not solved this problem,i wait for a fix please ;)
Of course, I can't see the problem, I couldn't see it with the original release, and I can't with the fixed files as well so, it would be quite difficult to fix a problem without seeing it.
What other addons you have for the area ?
What are your settings ? Have tweaked your FS9.CFG by hand regarding to mesh resolution to allow higher than normal resolutions ?
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Could you please try the files attached here ?
As before, the larger AFCAD should be in the fsdreamteam\PHOG\scenery folder, the smallest one, in the main Scenery\World\Scenery folder
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I am using windows XP SP3/FS-Genesis Mesh 19m/ FS-Genesis Landclass but no UT.
When landing on PHOG rwy 2 & 5, I got sometimes the runway peeling effect with the original FSDT Afcad2 file, which in most cases
is an elevation issue.
With the utility "JABBgl.exe , I try first an elevation of 2cm which was successful.
With the first elevation correction from Virtuali of 3 cm (all airport pos. at 16.460m or 540024 feets) and with the second correction files of 2cm (all airport pos at 16.459cm or 53.999 feets, fs9 default value) the peeling effect disappeared completely. The Ai aircrafts are also on the right level.
For me the problem is solved.
Thanks Virtuali for these outstanding airoports.
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Fabrizio/Umberto
I'm using FS9 and I tried the new AFCAD and bgl. Nothing changed, I still have this problem.
Fabrizio, I am using the mesh settings you mentioned below. All terrain settings are to the right (100%); water setting is Low.
Here's my system specs: XP SP3; 2.4 GHz; 3.25 RAM; Nvidia GeForce GT 220
Add-ons: Ground Environment Pro; Flight Environment; FSGenesis; Weathermaker Pro; nHancer
I have the same problem with PHNL, but not as bad. In PHNL, only the runway markings disappear after I land.
Thanks for your help.
Mike
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Sorry, but looking at the previous message from swiss1, the problem has been fixed entirely, and he has very similar specs to yours, including the use of FS Genesis.
Have you tried disabling FS Genesis ? Does it make any difference ?
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Yes, I tried it without FSGenesis and it still peels back. The only scenery I have activated is PHOG.
Reading Swiss1's reply, "With the utility "JABBgl.exe", I try first an elevation of 2cm which was successful". It appears he used this program, made his own corrections, and when used with your files, everything worked fine. Are you suggesting, we get JABBgl.exe, figure it out, and make our own corrections?
Mike
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Reading Swiss1's reply, "With the utility "JABBgl.exe", I try first an elevation of 2cm which was successful". It appears he used this program, made his own corrections, and when used with your files, everything worked fine. Are you suggesting, we get JABBgl.exe, figure it out, and make our own corrections?
From what I understand from his message:
I got sometimes the runway peeling effect with the original FSDT Afcad2 file, which in most cases is an elevation issue. With the utility "JABBgl.exe , I try first an elevation of 2cm which was successful.
It seems he fixed the problem on the *original* AFCADs, but it wasn't needed with the two fixes I've posted here.
With the first elevation correction from Virtuali of 3 cm (all airport pos. at 16.460m or 540024 feets) and with the second correction files of 2cm
So, it seems he fixed it in the exactly the same way we did in the 2nd AFCAD posted.
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Rectification for my previous message:
My first elevation correction with "JABBgl.exe " was from 16.457 to 16,459 m, which means "2mm" an not 2 cm., exactly the same value that Virtuali did with
the second correction. I am sorry for my mistake. Even 2mm can make a difference!
I have now this altitude 16.459 m or 53.999 foot and no peeling back on all runways.
The important thing is that you not forget to put the correction file "FSDT_PHOG_alt "in the scenery\world\scenery folder and to activate again in the FS9 library
to be sure that FS9 has accepted. I have many of this correction files.
If you have FS Genesis landclass, be sure to make a correct installation like indicated.
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exactly the same value that Virtuali did with
I have now this altitude 16.459 m or 53.999 foot and no peeling back on all runways.
That's confirms what I thought, thank you.
This is what the fix was all about: both the main AFCAD and the small one to be put into Scenery\World\Scenery that I've posted yesterday have exactly the same altitude at 16.459m, which is also the same as the default one, precise to the millimeter, which is the maximum allowable precision for AFCAD files anyway.
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Swiss1,
Yes I have the additional files installed in the correct folders and I reactivated PHOG, but I still have the problem with the runway peeling back when I land. I had this problem with PHLI first came out, but that was fixed with the patch. I still find it interesting that I only have/had this problem with airports not on the Big Island (PHKO/PHTO). I currently have it with PHNL and PHOG and I use to have it with PHLI.
Mike
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***FIXED***
Thanks Swiss1!!!! You are brillant! Using the program you mentioned (JABBgl) I was able to fix my problems with PHNL and PHOG. Without spending a lot of time getting it down to the exact mm, I changed the elevation at PHNL to 4.000 (from 3.962) and PHOG to 16.500 (from 16.459). Now, everything works perfectly. I'll probably keep experimenting with the program until I find the exact elevation I need. But for now, everything looks perfect. I have no floating/sinking AI or runway markings, so I guess raising the elevation didn't cause any other problems. I plan on making a long flight and see what happens.
Also, I now understand what Umberto and Fabrizo mean when they say they "can't see the problem." They can't. It would've taken them a long time to come up with the elevation that works for my system. They basically would be guessing because the changes they made would probably not look good on their system. I've been having problems with PHNL since Jul 10. Now, I can enjoy my hobby and fly around the islands! Cheers :)
Mike
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Glad to hear its fixed in FS9 :)
Is JABBbgl an fs9 program only? Do you know of any similar program that can change the airport elevation to the millimeter for FSX (other then ADE)?
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I don't know since I don't use FSX. I'm thinking it's just a FS9 program since it came out in 2004. However, I could be wrong.
Mike
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THANX,THANX,THANX,so much,Kelleymoe (Mike),the problem is solved to me too for PHNL and PHOG....best regards.... ;D
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Using the program you mentioned (JABBgl) I was able to fix my problems with PHNL and PHOG. Without spending a lot of time getting it down to the exact mm, I changed the elevation at PHNL to 4.000 (from 3.962) and PHOG to 16.500 (from 16.459).
That's interesting, 4 cm seems nothing, but is still quite a bit, considering the flatten it's lower than that so, the distance between the conflicting layers it's even more.
However, if it works for you, it shouldn't create any side effects, we might well use that value as standard.
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Umberto,
I plan on reducing the elevation until I get to the exact millimeter. At first I was doing 2mm at a time. That was taking too long, so I just picked 4.000 for PHNL and 16.500 for PHOG. There may be great distances between the layers, but moving around the airport, everything lays perfectly.
I still can't figure out why my elevation results, and some others, are so different than yours and the rest of the people? When I was trying to figure out PHNL, I bought a new harddrive, installed XP, install FS2004 and PHNL (nothing else) and I still had the problems after landing with the runway markings disappearing. There shouldn't have been any interferance from other scenery or add-ons. I wonder if it could be a hardware issue? I don't know, but for now, I'm enjoying beautiful Hawaii!
Mike
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My first test with the proposed altitude of 16.459m shows no runway peeling when starting at airport Phog and landing at Phog rwy 2 &5.
After several other tests, I noted again runway peeling starting at an other airport (ex. PHNY) and landing back at POG 2 & 5.
With the JABBgl.exe utility and trial and error method, I slowly increased the airport altitude till the point where I didn't see runway 2 & 5 peeling any more.
This standard altitude is 16.478 m which is 19mm higher than the FS9 default value.
I checked also the AI aircraft level which is ok ,(no floating aircraft).
Thanks all for the help.
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Basically, as long as you change both files to the same altitude ( the main AFCAD and the smaller one ), there shouldn't be an floating AI problem, that would only appear if you don't use the smaller file and change the altitude compared to the default one.
So, it's really doesn't matter which altitude you chose to use, since we are discussing about centimeters, it's not a big deal if the airport is set to an altitude 3-4 centimeters more than the real world, it never be realistic anyway, since no airport is really flat, and the published altitude it's just the one taken in the ARP reference point...whatever works for you, it's ok.
Yes, this could be hardware related, or more likely driver related. What affects the flickering at the driver level it's the Z-Buffer, the flickering happens because there's aren't enough bit used to get enough precision to represent altitude differences that small. Usually, you'd want to use a 32 bit Z-buffer, but made some research, and it seems some drivers cut corners and use a lower bit depth for the Z-buffer to get a performance boost, at the expense of image quality. In theory, WHQL certified drivers should have 24 bit z-buffer precision as minimum, but this might change between releases, tweaks, etc.
Note that, it's not possible to have a Z-buffer depth larger than the main color depth so, if you run FS9 in 16-bit color, it would have a worse 16 bit z-buffer too.
That might explain a difference in results between different systems.