Author Topic: vLSO Alpha Release  (Read 55174 times)

Paddles

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #60 on: October 14, 2011, 07:54:19 pm »
Ok, guys
Here's another WIP update, this time it's an upcoming vLSO beta version. I have completely reworked data acquisition and evaluation system, got rid of triggers and areas in the missions, added some user interface eyecandies, etc.... 

Now, going down the wish list of Capt...  ;)

-Keep tracking lateral and vertical paths for the debrief windows even for a wave off. Would be nice to see wave off performance in debrief, currently the path stops tracking on w/o. - DONE (see the images attached)

-option for  T-45c - DONE (some other aircraft are also supported)

-larger font for LSO grade and score, if it could also look hand written.. - DONE (see the images attached)

-add carrier profiles pictures to the debrief windows... - NOT SURE that this will look good. The distance axes are squeezed 5 times for better presentation of the glideslope and lineup deviations, so a carrier profile squeezed 5 times would look ugly...  ???

- add LSO, plat, air boss cams - DONE (for my missions)

- is it possible to add any support ships, usually a ship is several miles behind the carrier on guard - now it is possible to use any missions, provided there is a carrier (either the Acceleration or Javier's); say, TGS Day Traps mission which has a whole nicely placed strike group... If I have time, I'll try to add some vessels around the boat.

How is the "time in groove" calculated? - looks like it's now FIXED (see the images attached)  :)

I hope I'll be able to upload a beta version within the next few days...
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GOONIE

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #61 on: October 14, 2011, 08:22:35 pm »
Awesome news Serge!!!  ;D Can't wait for the new release.

Can you talk some more about the data acquisition and evaluation system changes? Are there more grades available (OK, No Grade, Fair, Cut)? To get a time of groove time of 12-18 seconds, will the program still work? What I mean is to achieve this time you have to fly a tight pattern, and you might not hit the vLSO trigger for ball call, what do you think?

Understand the issues with adding a carrier profile, just thought it could be eye candy for the debrief, did you see the example pictures I posted for this concept in an earlier post?

Finally, what is the status for uploading grades to a Greenie Board? Do we need a site or a server to do this? I guess it is not necessary now, just curious what it would take to make this feature work.

Thanks again for all your hard work, this is a great addition to FSX carrier flying!

-CAPT
"You've got to land here, son. This is where the food is."

wilycoyote4

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #62 on: October 14, 2011, 09:55:16 pm »
great, shocking, looking forward to the beta
thanks for the work

SUBS17

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #63 on: October 15, 2011, 05:41:57 am »
An idea for modders you can get Voice activated software so some aspects of carriers interaction for pilots with the LSO could be a possiblity. eg they call in their weight if I recall to the LSO who then sets it on the meatball or is it a setting for the wires? Anyway if you use voice activated software in the mission it could have that feature. Either that or a drop down menu. ideas anyone.  ;)
Great work BTW.

Paddles

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #64 on: October 15, 2011, 06:41:03 pm »
Thanks, guys  :)

Can you talk some more about the data acquisition and evaluation system changes? Are there more grades available (OK, No Grade, Fair, Cut)?
Well, previously the program sampled approach data every 50 ft and stored it in a fixed size table. Now it performs time-based sampling (four times per second) and store data in a variable length table, which gives me much more flexibility. If during beta testing this sampling rate appears insufficient, we'll try some other settings.
For an approach evaluation I will use the root mean square (or RMS) method, it's 'a statistical measure of the magnitude of a varying quantity'.  8) In our case these varying quantities are the glideslope and lineup deviations. However, do not expect full range of LSO grades in the initial beta release, this will take some time to tweak the program. Perhaps I will also ask you guys to share your logbook files - the more actual approach information the better...  ;D

Quote
To get a time of groove time of 12-18 seconds, will the program still work? What I mean is to achieve this time you have to fly a tight pattern, and you might not hit the vLSO trigger for ball call, what do you think?
I see. If they do it in real life, why not to do it in FSX? All we need is to somehow tell the program we're on a tight pattern, or, in other words, tell the vLSO 'I call the ball right here'. CAPT, in the first message you were talking about a button acting as a cue for the ball call. It's possible to make the program to response to certain FSX commands/buttons. Basically it looks like this - you assign a joy/keyboard button to an FSX command, tell the vLSO that this command is used for 'Ball' call and check 'Manual ball call' mark. From this moment the vLSO will not call the ball for you anymore, it will closely monitor your approach only from the moment you press that key/button. The same applied for 'Clara' call. I will try to add this feature to the next beta release.
It is also possible to use voice activated software, as SUBS17 proposed. For example, there's VAC (http://www.dwvac.com/), which binds your words to FSX commands. I suppose it could well be used with the vLSO too...

Quote
Understand the issues with adding a carrier profile, just thought it could be eye candy for the debrief, did you see the example pictures I posted for this concept in an earlier post?
Yes, I did, but transformed profiles would look bad, real bad. Look at this picture, these profiles are scaled just 50%, not 20% as they should...

Quote
Finally, what is the status for uploading grades to a Greenie Board? Do we need a site or a server to do this? I guess it is not necessary now, just curious what it would take to make this feature work.
Yes, for a Greenie Board we will need a site which provides an SQL server (for storing data) and capable to run PHP5 scripts. I have some experience in MySQL and PHP5.
Want it done right? Do it yourself!


Razgriz

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #65 on: October 15, 2011, 10:09:20 pm »
Quote
Finally, what is the status for uploading grades to a Greenie Board? Do we need a site or a server to do this? I guess it is not necessary now, just curious what it would take to make this feature work.
Yes, for a Greenie Board we will need a site which provides an SQL server (for storing data) and capable to run PHP5 scripts. I have some experience in MySQL and PHP5.

If Sludge doesn't mind you can use SludgeHornet.com's server.

Sludge

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #66 on: October 16, 2011, 09:19:54 am »
Raz and Serge...

Of course you can use SH.com, especially since I have plenty of space and pay for the domain. As a matter of fact, its already got a "greenie board" forum and space setup, so just let me know what you need Serge and once you get done with the changes for the Beta version, we can make that happen.

Later
Sludge

GOONIE

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #67 on: October 17, 2011, 06:05:19 pm »
Great news on the Greenie Board, thanks Sludge! Looking forward to using it. 

Serge, I have been trying to fly my patterns tighter, rolling into the groove ~ 3/4 mile to shorten my groove time like Mike said his son told him to do. Note this is harder than I thought. It would be great to have a manual "ball call" button to trigger the vLSO in later versions of the program, giving people the option to assign a button, or keep the automated trigger.

Understand on the distortion of the graphic, just thought it would look nice. Really like the W/O feature.

Looking forward to the additional scores being available in later versions, sounds like you are using some good methods for analyzing the data.

Finally, the mission has the carrier setup around Hawaii, was this done for looks or based on where the USN runs carrier quals tracks? Would it be possible to have another mission with a carrier off the coast of Oceana or California? Does anyone know where these types of carrier tracks normally run (real world) for carrier quals?

-CAPT
"You've got to land here, son. This is where the food is."

Sludge

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #68 on: October 17, 2011, 07:31:08 pm »
CAPT...

Rolling into the groove is quite hard to do ON TIME. I'm having trouble myself til I changed a little thing. Even though we are still HIGH WoD, IF you have VooDoo's carrier wake FIX, I'd advise starting your 180 turn just as you are hitting the end of the trail, VICE starting it directly ABEAM of the LSO Platform. You'll start to see the ROUNDDOWN of the carrier deck, and should be at 1.3 TCN.  If you hold a solid 27-30 AoB turn, you should hold 1.3 all the way around til crossing the wake... then you know what to do from there. I'll try to get some SCREEN CAPS, so others here can see what I'm talking about and shoot for that...

I've been experimenting with an .XML that will enable AUTO-RUDDER COORDINATION (IF it isnt already enabled) once you get into a landing configuration. I need everyone's input here. While flying this mission, enable AutoRudder (default keyboard should be CTRL-SHIFT-U) and let me know if its EASIER or HARDER to fly the pattern. This will let me know IF I need to continue and integrate the .XML or just leave this entirely up to the flyer to enable themselves.

Also, yes... carriers usually try to get close to all the coastal bases including Miramar (even though its now a Jarhead airstation... yes, I can say that, I'm still a Jarhead at heart); the USN tries to lump all its carrier quals in one place, since moving a carrier around is quite expensive. As you may or may not know, I was aboard the GW when the wire broke and NatGeo TV was filming... we were off the carolinas and had a mix of both T-45s and F-18s flying out of NAS Oceana, qualling for that week.

I think the option for a ball call button would be awesome. Can probly read some variable that nobody uses and then we can assign that to our GUNS trigger. That way, it can be a natural, easy thing to get used to as we roll out, instead of using a keyboard command.

One last thing, I told everyone I was working on my FLIGHT CHAIR. ITS DONE. Its a straight up POOR MAN's flight chair, that has holders for my stick (in the slightly left-twisted F-18 setup) and throttle on the side armrest. I'll get some pictures up on another thread, when I get them downloaded.

Later
Sludge

MikeB54

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #69 on: October 17, 2011, 08:55:41 pm »
CAPT,

Without having TrackIR or a multiple monitor setup I am finding it exceedingly difficult to fly a pattern with a less than 20 second TIG.  I basically do what Sludge described but stumbled on it a different way.  Once established on a 1.3 - 1.4 downwind abeam I glance to the left.  Once I can see the stern I pan the view back to center.  Once centered I start the turn.  I bet my patterns and Sludges are pretty close.  :)

Regarding having the carrier somewhere off the coast of San Diego, that was where my son did his carrier quals last Spring.  He was on the Stennis back at the end of March when the 18 had the engine explosion on the cat.  No, he wasn't the pilot but he was on deck at the time getting his jet ready to go.  I'm not so sure he knows exactly where they were at the time.  He boarded the Stennis at North Island.  The news reports said "100 miles off the coast" which would put them somewhere in the middle of W-291, which makes sense.  If the mission can be modified to put a carrier there then it would be conceivable that the mission could start on the ground at Miramar and fly out to the carrier.  You could fly the break, do a few passes, then fly back to Miramar.

Mike

SUBS17

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #70 on: October 17, 2011, 11:39:04 pm »
On a related note when the aircraft lands on the deck what do the ground crew do? Just wondering do they guide the jet to a cat or parking spot etc. As I just saw this:



I remember the DIs Superhornet days with ground crew guiding me to the cat in the Superhornet was quite cool. Its impressive to see this animation.

MikeB54

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #71 on: October 18, 2011, 12:23:59 am »
On a related note when the aircraft lands on the deck what do the ground crew do? Just wondering do they guide the jet to a cat or parking spot etc.

All aircraft movement on the flight deck and hanger deck is under the control of the Aircraft Directors, "Yellow Shirts", through a complex series of hand signals.  This link on Wiki gives a pretty good overview.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_United_States_Navy_carrier_air_operations

Mike

GOONIE

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #72 on: October 18, 2011, 03:08:03 am »
Sludge and Mike,
Thanks for the input, I agree it is really difficult to make that groove time in FSX with view and sim limitations (screen size, etc). If you can post pictures detailing the 180 to the groove Sludge that would helpful. Also I want to see this flight chair you've built.  8) I am up for trying the rudder mod, see if it helps, does it just coordinate rudder for your turn? Is it different then the FSX auto-rudder feature?

As for ship placement, Oceana or Miramar would be great, but I will leave it up to Serge. I don't want it to detract from other developments, because once you are in the groove it really doesn't matter where you are, unless you need to bingo/divert  ;)

Subs17, I saw the PMDG ground crew video, that would be awesome if Javier included this in his next carrier release. Looks like he already started with the shooter animation on the CATs. I thought it would be cool to have one guy animated after you trap, giving you the hook up signal, then taxi clear of the landing area, then directions to a CAT. I am sure it is possible, but I won't hold my breath.

-CAPT
"You've got to land here, son. This is where the food is."

Sludge

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #73 on: October 18, 2011, 04:07:30 am »
Mike...

Have you been flying FSX and putting your son's advice to use? How much difference have you noticed, especially here with Serge's vLSO mission?

CAPT...

Yeah, I'll go flying and get some pictures tonight, so that we can have an idea of what a decent 180 point looks like and when to start that 27-30 AoB turn. Also, its not really a big time mod its just an XML that asks if your AUTO-RUDDER (fsx feature) is enabled and if SO, it does NOTHING. If not, it enables it when in a landing configuration. Not very hard to do, other than making sure the landing parameters dont interfere into other flight regimes (ie. slow flight, gear/flaps down) that are similar to the basic landing configuration.

Later
Sludge

MikeB54

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Re: vLSO Alpha Release
« Reply #74 on: October 18, 2011, 04:32:39 am »
Mike...

Have you been flying FSX and putting your son's advice to use? How much difference have you noticed, especially here with Serge's vLSO mission?



Much to my wife's dismay, I have been flying a lot since I got back from San Diego.  LOL

Before my sim time my boarding rate using vLSO was 44% (47/108).  Since then my boarding rate has actually gone down a bit to 39% (21/54) but I'm catching more 2 and 3 wires.  I think part of this is because I have been trying to fly much tighter patterns.  I have one bad habit I need to break. I'm transitioning away from the ball and to the landing area way to early.  Actually, I don't think I'm supposed to be transitioning to the landing area at all but old habits are hard to break.  What this causes me to do is dump it at the ramp.  My glideslope graphs aren't too bad until I hit the AR mark and then they take a nosedive.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2011, 05:34:39 am by MikeB54 »